Marquez-Pac 4 shows the importance of strength and conditioning

Discussion in 'Boxing Training' started by dealt_with, Dec 8, 2012.

  1. dealt_with

    dealt_with Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

    9,938
    1,218
    Apr 27, 2012
    A proper periodised strength and conditioning program can make a big difference as shown by Marquez' obvious increase in punching power for this fight. Pacquiao looked good in terms of his boxing but he was clearly outgunned. Note that Ariza claimed Pac hadn't been following his strength program. People are going to call PED's just like when Pacquiao moved up and started proper conditioning but that's because boxing is 'old school' and full of uneducated opinions.
    The old 'punchers are born' line should be thrown away, there's no reason not to embrace modern training methods and boxing coaches need to get that through their thick heads.
     
  2. Jdsm

    Jdsm Well-Known Member Full Member

    2,184
    0
    Aug 8, 2010
  3. r1p00pk

    r1p00pk Well-Known Member Full Member

    2,555
    1
    Mar 12, 2012

    ive always believed that you could be made a puncher from the right program but ive been scared to even say that because of ridecule from other posters. Good form is obviosly the first most important thing but power comes from the strength and weight of the body? correct me if im wrong
     
  4. dealt_with

    dealt_with Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

    9,938
    1,218
    Apr 27, 2012
    Technique and balance are the most important things but if all the links of the chain (the muscles and tendons) are stronger and have the correct properties for the movement of a punch then power will be improved. Muscles contract with more force and tendons recoil at greater speeds after periodised strength training.
    A tendon is like a rubber band, Your brain tells your muscles to contract and your muscles then perform work on the tendon. If the tendon is loose (compliant) then it takes longer to take up the slack and recoil. What that means is that there is a delay between your brain telling you to do something and you actually doing it. That's called the electromechanical delay.
    Heavy weight training makes the tendons stiffer so there is less time between a decision and movement. A stiffer or thicker elastic band also recoils with more force if it's stretched the same distance as a thinner or more compliant tendon.
    So your movements are quicker and more forceful, even though lifting a heavy weight slowly isn't sports specific to boxing. Heavy weights also help you to recruit more muscle and prevent inhibition of force from the neuromuscular system.When you're stronger it improves your fine motor movements and skill learning as well as less nervous system resources are needed to perform the movement.
    It's important that it's part of a periodised program though, you can't perform heavy weight training right up to the day of a fight. When tendons are stretched you lose energy through heat loss. To make your tendons more efficient and lower hysteresis (heat loss) then plyometric training needs to be incorporated. After heavy weight training plyometrics are more effective as your ceiling is higher for power production. Recovery is very important and less is more when developing strength and power.
    The heavier you are the stiffer your tendons tend to be (Women have compliant tendons), transferring the weight through the kinetic chain effectively while maintaining balance makes a big difference as well so that's why the heavier the person the harder they'll tend to punch.
    I think it's particularly important for lighter fighters to lift heavy weights, training for strength (not hypertrophy).
    If anybody tells you that punchers are born then it's they who should be ridiculed. Most people don't even know that slow twitch fibres can be trained into fast twitch fibres, for a long time people only thought that fast twitch could be converted to slow twitch. Everything is trainable, what you do alters your genetic expression and neuromuscular recruitment capabilities.
    Boxing is in the dark ages, you can see in life that when people don't understand something they ascribe it to god/the supernatural/they were born like that and choose tradition (something that isn't challenging or scary). That's a lazy defeatist attitude that's still prevalent in the boxing game. Nothing is just because. /endrant
     
  5. pichuchu

    pichuchu Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,751
    3
    Mar 13, 2011
    Strength and conditioning is important in boxing only a ******ed would disagree.
    I agree with the statement punchers are born and not made aswell. My view is that a good strength and conditioning routine will help you reach your natural potential in regards to how hard you hit, in the same way a sprint coach can't create the next usain bolt from scratch no matter how good his training methods are. He can only maximise that person to reaching their natural potential.
     
  6. Nipple

    Nipple I hate my username banned

    5,338
    5
    Sep 6, 2010
    *Awaits ROACH to disagree and harp on about b/w exercises*

    The thing is is that JMM was DRINKING HIS OWN **** a few months ago due to him being another one of the countless thousands of Boxers who have NO IDEA about how beneficial a great S&C coach can be for you.

    Keep doing your crunches and your sit ups boys.... Zzzz.
     
  7. pecho26

    pecho26 ESB Lurker Full Member

    2,326
    2
    Nov 19, 2010
    Yap........i was very sad that pacquaio lost but jmm looked like a beast.S&C coaches are absolutely neccesary in todays sports.
    I wont contribute the loss on pacs not doing arizas regime,but.........
     
  8. viru§™

    viru§™ Boxing Junkie Full Member

    9,486
    101
    Aug 28, 2007
    I guess this if proof new school is better than old school! :good
     
  9. CHAL_DIESEL

    CHAL_DIESEL GOAT Full Member

    2,385
    0
    Mar 18, 2011
    :good
     
  10. CHAL_DIESEL

    CHAL_DIESEL GOAT Full Member

    2,385
    0
    Mar 18, 2011
    Boxing always progresses. Look at some of the early 1900s fighters, most wouldn't of even been contenders let alone champions.
     
  11. scrap

    scrap Boxing Addict Full Member

    6,438
    55
    Jul 15, 2006
    Who was in Front on the scores, when it happened
     
  12. pichuchu

    pichuchu Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,751
    3
    Mar 13, 2011
    I would say pac by maybe 1 round.
     
  13. CHAL_DIESEL

    CHAL_DIESEL GOAT Full Member

    2,385
    0
    Mar 18, 2011
    I had Pacquiao up by one round, and about to go up by another, but then he got caught flush with a beautiful counter right hand.
     
  14. greynotsoold

    greynotsoold Boxing Addict Full Member

    4,160
    3,213
    Aug 17, 2011
    I had Marquez up by a point after 5, though he had lost the 6th until...
    Marquez was punching hard last night- at least with three or four right hands- but I don't think he looked especially good, didn't seem sharp. That could have been age, or maybe some of those left hands hurt him, or maybe just as he was getting warmed up that right hook broke his nose.
     
  15. Big N Bad

    Big N Bad Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,990
    11
    Nov 29, 2007
    some interesting posts.

    but this thread is all based on one fighter winning a fight after changing his traning by basically trining HARDER and doing slightly different exercises.

    I will give two examples of a fighter who started training with a S&C coach
    and both guys got knocked out in brutal fashion for the first time in their career!

    paul williams against sergio martinez 2. im not certain but i think i saw the build up to this fight and paul williams talks about his new training. we know what happened in the fight!

    2. MMA- big nog vs cain velasquez.
    never had big nog been knocked out before. he starts working with a S&C coach. he gets brutally knocked out in the 1st round!

    Guys like edwin valero and joe calzaghe, both had very old school yet intense training regimes. i have NEVER seen any fighter who had their kind of work rate. valero was a superfeather weight/ lightweight who punched like a middleweight. both had granite chins.