Marvelous Marvin Hagler Vs Roy Jones jr

Hagler had taken the punches of Eugene Hart, I'm fairly positive he could deal with Jones' power. And the very fact that Jones threw more meaningful shots than Leonard (when on the back foot) is a factor in his downfall. It's hard to counter a flurry, but not potshots. I can see Hagler just tucking up and jabbing at the same time Jones punches, obviously it wouldn't work all the time, but it'd soften him up for later.

 

roy jones decision....fairly comftorable

 

No, boxing Roy isnt the answer. I've always said that based on the track record. How can you say that countering Roy is the answer? For 12 rounds??

You have to take it to him with strong a commitment to do or die and very few could ever do that with Roy. I first noticed this in the Pazienza fight but Vinnie didnt have the size. Otherwise, he would have been more successful. Griffin also was actually ahead but starting wearing down around 7th round and Roy took over like the master that he is.

marvin - early 80s version, would not wear out and wouldnt get hit nearly as much. Even if Marvin does fall behind, he has the uncanny ability to rev up his attack to unbelievable levels and almost immediately stop his man. It's happened in the Colbert fight, the Finnegan fight, I've seen it in the Scypion fight, the Hearns fight, the Obel fight and the second Hamsho fight when he began butting Marvin.

I like Marvin by tko for the ultimate victory

 

Maybe the old Jones that worked, but not the best Jones. Look how he lost to Tarver, and look how he was befuddled by Griffen. Griffen didnt take it to Roy, he counterpunched. Roy let Pazienza get close and flurry on him because Paz couldnt crack an egg, and then he opened up a can of whoop ass on him and knocked him out. He could have KO'd Paz whenever he wanted. That fight was a total joke. Roy would let opponents get close to him if they couldnt hit hard. If they did, he stayed in the middle of the ring and let them lead.
Look how Tarver knocked him out and beat him in the third fight. It was almost a complete joke at times as Tarver just waited and waited for Roy to lead as he stood there and just flicked a lazy jab. Who said anything about boxing him? I said wait for him to come to you and try and counter him. That was his style. Lou Del Valle did the same thing. He waited for Jones to lead and threw that straight punch right down the middle. That was the only way a fighter could catch Jones. Make him lead, pick up a rhythem in his punches, and try and punch in between them to try and catch him coming in. Jones was just too quick going backwards and too quick in the clinches.

 

Jones flurries too, especially in his prime, but actually I think its easier to counter a flurry, you only have to slip and counter 1 shot

 

Potshotting is a form of counterpunching. Jones reaction time was so quick, he could land much harder on a fighter coming forward that he was countering. He could counter over a jab or a power punch. Jones was knocking out guys that were walking around at heavyweight and fighting at LH. He would have had a big advantage over Hagler in the power department, not to mention the speed at which he was delivering those shots.

 

actually, Tarver also had great success in the first bout with Roy by pressing him. The only problem is that he let up too often and Roy being the true great that he is, even in a weakened state, pulled it out. Roy showed increible heart.

But I fear that marvin was just too much warrior with too much skill, and too powerful for even Roy. He just doesnt let up and the fact is, no one else can fight like Marvin but Marvin himself

Griffin did pretty well by taking it to him and bulling him which surprised me. But he didnt have that do or die commitment and just wore out. Once he wore out, Roy dismantled him. and in the rematch, Montell was already so psyched out, he wasnt mentally tough enough to compete.

You used the Del Valle fight to prove your point, pointing out the KD but using the tactics you mentioned, he still failed to win the fight. I gave Roy 11 rounds

 

I used that example of how to actually land on him, because he was almost never hit cleanly. Both Tarver and Griffen were counterpunchers. Of course they press forward behind their jabs, but ultimately liked to land their big shots off of counters or in between their opponents shots, same as Jones Jr, only difference is Jones was so quick he could counter a step rather than a punch.

 

Can't hurt what you can't hit. Jones is leonard with more speed and pop.

 

What the **** are 'some' people on about in this thread? Honestly.

What? No, that would be countering one punch. Unless you think it's easy to counter the first shot of a shoeshine flurry without having the rest bop you on the nose? Flurries are hard to counter because there isn't a lot of weight being thrown into them; there's less for the defender to manipulate with his counter. Imagine it; the flurry starts with a straight right, you try to parry it with your left hand. There's not a lot behind it so it's not like you're going to throw him off balance and leave him open, not to mention he's throwing several more at you in the meantime.

No, not always. Plenty of times I saw Jones just hitting at will without the other fighter throwing a punch - not countering. In the boxing section of the Oxford dictionary, under 'counter' it does not say 'pot shot.' Pot shots are neat & tidy punches thrown usually not as counters, infact, but more as a prevention, i.e., a circling fighter may 'pot shot' a more stationary fighter and not allow him to get going.

 

I feel Jones is ahead on points early on, due to his speed. Over the course of the fight, however, Marvin digs in, and his tenacity begins to even out the bout. Over 12, I feel Marvin wins by a slim decision. In a 15 round bout, I think Marvin's constant pressure finally wears Jones down, somewhere between rounds 13-15.

 

Another point raised; it definitely needs to be a fifteen round fight because otherwise Hagler does lose. Championship rounds he'd (hopefully) step it up.

 

Hagler by stoppage late.

Jones was a little tight at middle, certainly as he approached his peak.

 

These are two of my three all-time favourite boxers, the other being Ray Robinson. And I hated seeing either of these guys lose. But Roy would have too much for Marvin, even the special version of Hagler that beat Minter and others up so convincingly.

Roy just had a combination of speed, power and elusiveness that is unmatched in boxing history. And to those who say Roy peaked at 168... maybe. But I always thought Roy was consistently brilliant from 160 to 175 in almost every fight (Griffin I is an exception). Roy has enough on his punches to keep Hagler away from him for 12 rounds - definitely - and very possibly for 15 too.

Roy UD Marvin

 

The contingent of the Jones' H2H Fantasy Brigade is getting worse. Just last month they had Jones beating Monzon. And now it's Hagler. They watch and rewatch their Jones' Greatest Hits DVD against a parade of day-jobbers and recall "Hagler-Leonard" and think they're on to something.

Reality-check:

Roy Jones had about 26 fights as a MW. He was 25 years old when he stepped up to the Super middles after making one defense of his IBF title. That is not enough of a pedigree for him to even dare to step in the ring against Hagler and I'm not altogether convinced that he would if he could find a way to avoid facing 1980-1982 beastly Hagler.

Hagler has the chin to take Jones' potshots. He has the power to hurt him and keep him modest. The pressure Hagler brings is precisely what Jones would not want and would not cope with well. Jones is not the supreme counterpuncher that he is being made out to be here. He relies on fast-twitch fibers, speed and good legs, but is not about capitalizing on mistakes. He overwhelms most guys with his athletic talent, not his mediocre technique --that ain't enough against elites like Hagler or Monzon or Robinson.

Jones doesn't have the disposition to withstand what these three will bring. They are tried-and-true, highly experienced heavy-hitters who have magnificent chins as insurance to diminish Jones' chances.