MAX BAER IN PLACE OF FOREMAN?

Your last few posts have been devoted solely to proving Baer to be better than he really was. That's what I've been responding to. Had you stuck to your original line of argument there would have been little issue from me, but for some reason you thought it a smart idea to start comparing him to Lomachenko and Parker, which is where, my friend, you truly went off the deep end.

Why are you still responding to me anyway?

 

Carnera like most tall guys, uses a step back jab. He leans in throws the jab and steps back as quickly as he can to get out of range. Baer launches the punch as the jab extends and it connects before Carnera can complete the step back, it literally happens in less than second of real time.

Carnera doesn't really do anything technically wrong, he just got timed by a quicker opponent. That's boxing.

Your argument here is kind of confusing, it seems to me your insisting that Carnera is so bad...that all Baer has to do is throw a right hand and it will land. That sounds a bit whacky to me, like you are scared to give either man anything resembling credit.

 

That's a matter of opinion.

You claimed you could match my clips of Baer's explosive leads and quick foot work with modern fighters regarded as being slow. The only fighter that came close was Parker, who is not regarded as being slow. Worse, you could only produce clips of Parker matching Baer's hand speed and failed completely to produce any clips of Parker moving like Baer.

Regarding Lomachenko, you are stubbornly insisting two forearm shoves are radically different but could only argue subjective intentions. And for whatever reason produced clips of Wlad that don't feature any use of the forearm.

You have shown yourself to be an irrational sociopath. I killed the Baer argument, but I will no longer discuss any boxing with you, period. I can't imagine a bigger waste of time.

The Wlad clips sealed it for me. Sometimes things are in the eye of the beholder but you are flat out wrong in saying Wlad uses a forearm in those clips, especially the first one, then like any sociopath you refuse to admit you were mistaken and blame me for your crappy clip. This is mind boggling.

 

Carnera did everything wrong. Guys with his poor reflexes, overall clumsiness, and mediocre sense of distance, don't have the luxury of pulling back with their heads high and hands low. He kept his left perilously low --before, during, and after he reached and pushed with that clumsy jab--and he attempted to retreat from the punch in embarrassingly inept fashion.

 

Okay, let's recap:

#130: You refused to acknowledge a jab or that Primo was reaching.
#135: You call me shameless for pointing out the jab, insist there was no reach and then refer to it as an aborted jab.
#139: He reached and pushed with that clumsy jab.

And not once, a single admittance of error, just an arrogant continuation as if this had been your point the whole time.

 

Nice try. He begins the act of reaching and pushing the jab but aborts it (clumsily and ineptly). As he does so, he backs up to avoid Baer's punch, with his head high and glove low. I denied your contention that Baer's unorthodox (but apparently sound and responsible) defensive techniques lured Primo into reaching excessively. I also explained that he was leaning back, away from Baer when he was caught, having aborted his jab in a clumsy display of ineptitude.

 

This has already been shown to be false.

[url]https://ibb.co/gjuUbv[/url]

Carnera's left arm is fully extended as Baer is already in the process of throwing the right hand.

How does one abort a jab that has already reached full extension?

You are creating a ridiculous long narrative of factual inaccuracies and subjective readings to fit a split second of action into your agenda. It's simple, Carnera was executing his step back jab as he did previously in the round, but Baer timed him before he could complete the pull back. That's all that happened.

And I would say it very much fits into what I said, given Carnera got caught while pulling back from a reaching jab that sacrificed his height.

 

Yes, your opinion, and it's worthless. You're still harping on about the strained Lomachenko comparison and you're claiming you're not trying to hype Baer up?

Go back to your original line. That, at least, had some basis in reality.

Here's what I said: "Again, not super impressive. You could pick a dozen other HWs of the past few years with comparable speed and explosiveness." Post #58

I said nothing about modern fighters regarded as being slow. That was a response to your comment on the Ugonoh clip.

Speaking of Ugonoh, here's another clip where he's a bit fresher:

[url]https://streamable.com/u415i[/url]

Do I think that's particularly impressive hand or footspeed? No. But it's enough to match Baer.

Of course the intent behind the move is important. Both Loma and Wlad attempt to blind their opponent to a quick scoring shot, or in Wlad's case a knockdown shot. They do this by hiding the trajectory of the shot with their opposing hand. Contact is irrelevant and incidental in the Loma example since the opponent was already ducking down. At no point does either fighter try to physically shove their opponent off the way Baer does, because that is not the intent of the move.

Once again your reading of the clips is completely wrong. Loma does not "shove" his opponent. If he did then the opponent would have moved off to one side the way Schmeling did. Why didn't he then? Because he was not shoved. I hope you can follow that line of reasoning.

[url]https://preview.ibb.co/e0UcWv/Screen_Shot_2017_09_08_at_11_12_12.png[/url]

Three possibilities: you don't know what you're talking about, you have very poor understanding of human anatomy, you're a stone cold liar.

And yet we all know how this'll go. Care to surprise me for once?