Max Baer vs. Foreman

I actually had a dream about this match-up last night. No kidding.

My argument for Baer's chances in this fight are workrate, size and chin, with the bonus he has a great punch. These are elements that have given Big George problems.

I still think George would win most times, but Baer's chances are better than most might imagine.

 

For Baer read Lyle?
Lyle, Better boxer than Max, lesser puncher, Less stamina u know something not a bad match-up.
Still George too strong and a better boxer.

 

Baer was a more down the pike type of puncher and George wa a wide swinger but George had that early start. I think Max hit harder than Lyle but he was also inconsistant. I would lean towards Foreman but would not count Max out to KO Foreman

 

Baer's best chances are if both guys are pitted when they were peaked........ Baer of 1932 to 1934 and Foreman from 1972 to 1974 were close in skills, power and size; Foreman a hair bigger........ The aged Foreman of 1991 and 257 pounds was bigger, slower but more so skilled and patient....... '91 Foreman beats '33 Baer with smarts and savvy, and then, power..........

MR.BILL

 

Yeah, I don't think Max could throw a down the pike punch by accident.

 

Yeah, that was my reaction as well.

Max was a heavyweight Merqui Sosa.

 

Well, a young Foreman only through ONE punch straight down the pike himself, and that was his thudding left-jab....... Everything else was wide in the 1970s......... By the 1990s, Charlie Shipes, Archie Moore and Dundee got George Foreman straightened out and more so relaxed........ Too bad Foreman was over 40 then....... Still, Foreman is perhaps the greatest 40+ year old fighter with a seriousness in the ring than history ever saw...... I cannot think of anyone as strong, powerful and able to absorb punishment like the 40+ Foreman........ Incredible.....

Mad Max Schmeling was washed up and losing to Louis Nova by KO / TKO at the tender age of 32 in 1941---circa........

MR.BILL

 

Baer's stamina and durability could potentialy win this for him. He had a chin like cinder block and had proven ability to fight for 20 rounds.

If the slugfest went into round six then I would probably shift the betting in favour of Baer.

Aside from that, fights between two big sluggers of this type can get prety random, and prety backward and forward. You just wouldn't know what was going to happen.

I would be curious to see which version of Baer showed up. He could be sneaky when he chose to, particularly later in his career.

 

I would only favor Foreman because Baer was so inconsisent, if he shows up for a fight he could present Big George with some serious problems. When he wanted to he was excellent at parrying punches and timing that quick loopy right hand over the top...not unlike the punch Lyle badly hurt Foreman with early.


Faded but motivated Baer scores a shocking stoppage over 29-1 never stopped 6'3" 207 lb Pat Comiskey, a than 20 year old well regarded power punching prospect with an 86% KO ratio.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=begybILjnuQ&feature=related[/ame]


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X0Nreg5t0y8&feature=related[/ame]

 

The stamina factor would basically be Baer's best advantage. If he could weather the storm for several rounds, and even keep Foreman at bay with some big shots of his own, he might be able to wear him down for a late stoppage.

I do however feel that Foreman's endurance problems are unduely over stated. He really only gassed once in his first career, which consisted of 47 pro bouts. The single incident came against the greatest fighter of all time in a match where they were fighting in unusually hot conditions.. What's more, it wasn't like Foreman just ran out of gas the minute the bell rang for the 8th round. He was punching himself out since the word go. People also forget that Ali had to pay for that victory by taking an ungodly number of hard shots before his opportunity finally came. Its reasonable to say that Foreman's stamina was very poor, but I would be very careful about betting money on just anyone who could merely extend him beyond the 5th round.

 

The only technique I've seen Max Baer display is in this short instructional documentary:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RpFTVrutZe4[/ame]


Baer stated that he would prove everyone wrong by defeating better boxers with simple slugging. Against a young Foreman he wouldn't necessarily be facing a better boxer though. This match-up is pretty much all about strength, power, the ability to take it and thus I'd favour Foreman slightly.

Foreman could land the jab at will on Baer but Baer was willing to take some in order to get his right hand in. He wouldn't have much trouble landing it on Foreman. Lyle didn't.

 

maxie baer=willie pep

 

Carnera had comparable size and physical strength to Foreman's, if not the punching power. (Vastly superior endurance to George though.) Max had a reverse gear, and he skipped backwards liberally with Primo. He could use movement well enough to take Foreman into deep water, and was absolutely capable of replicating the strategy Tommy Morrison used on an aged Big George. Unlike Jimmy Young, Maxie had the power to hurt Foreman early, and could use it whenever George's efficient ring cutting threatened to compromise his own stamina. Max had faster hands, and a grotesquely underrated left hook.

Individual bombs didn't seem to trouble Maxie, and he clowned his way through some massive thuds from Galento. Foreman could not expect to stop him as the result of a single shot, and would almost certainly expend himself early if he did somehow manage to stun Baer. It's critical to recognize that the reverse would not be true. Despite his opening round assault on a shell shocked Carnera, Maxie held plenty in reserve, more than enough to last through 15 rounds. He was far, far more relaxed in the ring than a peak Foreman.

George would need to get inside Baer's head before they climbed into the ring. If he failed to intimidate Max beforehand (and only Louis did), then he'd be a dead duck if this one went beyond eight rounds. There is no way Foreman gets to the final bell if Baer is still standing at that point.

Keep in mind that only a peaking Louis was able to take Max out, and it never looked like Baer's senses were compromised even then. (Only at the end of the Nova rematch does he appear in genuine distress.)

My belief is that Max does defeat George. His hands were faster in exchanges of power, he was generally more relaxed, had sufficient height, reach and mobility, and 20 round stamina. Foreman's best chance to win would be to advance behind his jab, and confine himself largely to boxing with that offensive weapon alone. Baer did not usually punch on the move, preferring to set himself first.

While Magoo is correct in pointing out that Foreman's endurance problems are overstated (and in fact it was Lyle who finally collapsed for the count from exhaustion in their classic war), Maxie is not "just anyone who could merely extend him beyond the 5th round" (and I fully agree with him that this blind assumption is excessively simplistic), but somebody who maintained sufficient late round power to get the job done when the time came.