Max Schmeling vs. Larry Holmes

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Melankomas, Feb 2, 2023.

  1. Raheem

    Raheem Member banned Full Member

    Jan 28, 2023
    I have never considered Louis and Holmes to have similar styles, other than yeah they're both "technically correct" and they both throw jabs.
    Chris Byrd is technically correct and he throws jabs too. I wouldn't compare his style to Louis or homes though.
    But I will go ahead and make time to watch rewatch a few Louis and Holmes over the next few nights, and see if I take away anything differently this time
    swagdelfadeel likes this.
  2. PRW94

    PRW94 New Member Full Member

    Nov 26, 2020
    I pick Holmes but Schmeling was a lot better fighter than he displayed on 6/22/38.
    mr. magoo likes this.
  3. janitor

    janitor Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    Feb 15, 2006
    There are certainly significant differences, but the punches that you would use to counter them are very similar, and very different from punches that you would use to counter Ali.
  4. Melankomas

    Melankomas Active Member Full Member

    Dec 18, 2022
    True, they were both more open to right hands than Ali was. And Schmeling had one of the greatest rights in history.
  5. greynotsoold

    greynotsoold Boxing Addict Full Member

    Aug 17, 2011
    One of the things that enabled Schmeling to be successful against Louis was his defense, including the way that he positioned himself. First, he rarely was right in front of Louis because he kept his lead foot close to the left foot of Louis. It is hard to open up on a guy in that position because he gets his head outside your left shoulder and your left hook. To land a right hand you have to punch across your body which is a risky thing against a guy looking to land his own right hand, hence the Louis dependance on the jab.
    Second, when he missed his right hand Schmeling got way over his left leg which took his head out of line for a straight right hand counter. When Louis tried to roll the right hand and counter with a right uppercut, Schmeling used his cross arm defense. His right glove was in a position to block the right uppercut, and his left glove caught the hook when Louis tried to counter to the liver.
    Would he fight Holmes that way or would it work against Holmes? I don't know. But Larry was not nearly as versatile as Louis in his offense; he was a jab/right hand guy that sometimes showed a right uppercut. The difference could be in how Larry used his feet; if he keeps moving to his left and can get around the lead foot of Schmeling it will make him stand up more.
    KasimirKid likes this.
  6. ThatOne

    ThatOne Well-Known Member Full Member

    Jan 13, 2022
    Was the left hook Ali's kryptonite?
  7. ThatOne

    ThatOne Well-Known Member Full Member

    Jan 13, 2022
    In their second fight Joe was looking for that big right hand.
    greynotsoold likes this.
  8. The Long Count

    The Long Count Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Oct 8, 2013
    Style wise Max could compete in this bout. His best strength plays into Larry’s biggest weakness. People short change Max he beat 4 hall of fame boxers. Louis, Sharkey, Stribling, Walker. Actually more than Larry. Not that beating hall of famers is a barometer but Max was good. I’d pick Larry but I think Max shakes him a few times
    Pugguy likes this.
  9. janitor

    janitor Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    Feb 15, 2006
    Yes in a word.

    Hardest punch in the book to time going backwards.
  10. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    Apr 27, 2005
    Did Burt Sugar write great things about them?
    Pugguy likes this.
  11. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker Full Member

    Jul 15, 2008
    Its an interesting fight ... I feel Holmes was a class above and wins by decision or possibly a later round TKO .. just too fast and skilled ...
  12. robert ungurean

    robert ungurean Богдан Philadelphia Full Member

    Jun 9, 2007
    Of course. I don't think Louis jab was anywhere near as fast or busy as Holmes was. Larry was also moving more than Joe. Apples and oranges for me.
  13. guilalah

    guilalah Well-Known Member Full Member

    Jul 30, 2004
    Holmes, but perhaps uncomfortably for Larry.
    Pugguy likes this.
  14. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 *Resident* Gadfly Full Member

    Sep 22, 2021
    I think Schemling turns the trick- staying low was part of the plan to draw the counter, a taller opponent may make his Louis plan more applicable.
  15. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 *Resident* Gadfly Full Member

    Sep 22, 2021
    You mean fundamentally broken and overly reliant on a few tricks that only work on dumb fighters? There was no master club fighters like Ken Norton who beat? Around in the 30s so I’m sure Holmes would dominate.