Mayweather, Jones, and Whitaker were too dominant at their best to have rivals shoul

It's not like most of us on here don't have a consistent topic or fighter(s) that we manage to discuss at every opportunity. If I know you for that, it's because you argue your points really well.

Sounds good. I like the fight for Sergio to get to perform in front of the home crowd as the champ against a top ten middleweight. I'm hoping everything's gone well with his knee because he's acting as if it won't be a hindrance in the slightest, and I think said he had the torn meniscus before the Chavez fight? :blood It'll be an interesting gauge of what he's got left.

Too bad Roy and Pernell didn't hold onto their speed and reflexes to that age. :verysad
(Yeah, there are an immense number of obvious reasons, just keeping on topic a little bit)

 

Basically a lot of the Euro guys, Dariusz being the main one. They were all a bunch of reluctant champs.

BHop is a dick and he didn't deserve the money he was asking for but if Roy was into building a legacy and not just his ego, he would have accepted the terms and beat him up.

Sometimes you have to do what's unfair in order to prove you're the best, like fighting in corrupt countries or conceding to silly fighters and their quirks at the negotiation table.

 

Floyd-Pac what a shame

 

Hi there,

Roy didn't duck DM. Roy and his team made several attempts to make the fight, but DM didn't want to take the risk. If you want to see some interesting links, I'll post them for you.

Regarding Hop, it was the battle of he ego's. I wish they'd have fought for 50/50 too, but if you look from Roy's perspective, why should he have accepted it? Bernard originally wanted more money than Roy at the start of heir famous argument on HBO. Then he backed down and wanted 50/50.

But Roy had the win over him in 93, and he would have had to have gone down in weight for the catch weight. At the time, he was also looking at going up to heavy. So at the time, he was never going to come down in weight, when he would have needed to bulk up soon, to fight a guy who he'd already beaten, who he didn't like for 50/50. It was never going to happen. Hop gaining 7/8 pounds was a lot easier than Roy losing them.

Also, we all know that if Bernard had have won the 93 fight, there's no way he would have fought Roy for 50/50. He would have wanted the lions share. So it's a real shame the fight was never made, but I don't blame Roy, and I hold Bernard solely responsible. It's easy for us to say that Roy should have accepted the terms, but we weren't in his shoes.


Regards, Loudon.

 

Loudon's RJJ detector finally alerted hin.

 

It's running a little slow, due to it being Xmas, but it's still working. :good

 

He never wanted to leave Europe and dont compare Europe to fighting Chavez in San Antonio. If you think Whitaker got a bad shake in Texas Roy wouldve had to ko Darius for a draw.

60-40 ill kick your ass. Roy already beat Hopkins aswell.

Some flimsy reasons for calling him a "reluctant champion" got here

 

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:good

 

Was only a matter of time. Roy hasn't really been getting attacked too much in this one, he's got Toney and Hopkins. The former was 'the fight to make' like Whitaker-Chavez, Mayweather-Pacquiao and he dominated it. Whitaker dominated it. Floyd likely would've dominated it... But it never happened.

 

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Neither wanted to give up home court. I can understand Roy's reticence, especially given what happened in Seoul, but like I said, sometimes you have to deal with unfairness to secure your legacy. Do you think it would have been fair for Whitaker to say I'm not fighting in Chavez country, only for the fight to fall through? Or I'm not fighting DLH in front of his cheerleading squad in Vegas? Or McGirt in his hometown? Don't forget Whitaker had already been screwed in Paris by Sulaiman and co.

I understand Roy's thinking, Hopkins was being unreasonable, but at the end of the day he let an opportunity slip to define himself from Hopkins. Oh well, at least he has his ego to keep him warm at nights now hey?

 

Sweet scientist,

I understand your point, but the examples that you've given aren't really the same as Roy having to go to Germany in 2001.

"I don't think a knockout would guarantee me a win over there!" Roy Jones - 2001.

Roy was the best fighter in the world and the unified champ. The onus was on DM to go to Roy. According to Roy, DM turned down $5M from HBO. DM's promoter Peter Kohl also refused the opportunity of a double header to promote the fight, and he was never available to sit down with Roy's advisor and HBO to try and make the fight. Roy was more than willing to fight DM in the U.S. DM and Kohl passed up the opportunity, and then continued to fight In Germany against the likes of Harmon and Hall who Roy had easily beaten. There's a big difference between Roy not wanting to go to Germany, and you saying that Roy ducked him. He didn't duck him.

Not in Roy's opinion. He had nothing to prove, and when the fight couldn't be made, he went up to heavy and then back again to create history.


Regards, Loudon.

 

For starters, Roy was not actually the unified champ. He gave away the WBC title in '98, which was then won by Rocchigiani when he beat Nunn. A US court has upheld Rocchigiani's claim to the WBC title up until his loss to Dariusz, meaning he was still a co-titlist when Dariusz beat him in 2000.

Besides that, Roy didn't amass his LHW titles overnight. There was a period of a few years in between moving up from SMW and winning his 3rd LHW title, after the titles had been stripped or giving up by Dariusz and then held by other fighters.

As far as being the best, that's something that's proven by doing the very thing which you're excusing here. The notion that a fighter who purports to be "the best" has nothing to prove is inherently contradictory.

That's Roy's side of the story. On the flipside, Dariusz and his people have claimed that Roy's people weren't interested in a fight in America, saying there wasn't enough money or demand for it there, and then priced themselves out of a fight in Germany. Personally, I take both of these "he said, she said" stories with a grain of salt.

What is true is that Roy initially told Boxing Monthly in around '97 that he was willing to fight Dariusz in Germany, with the expectation that he would earn around $8-$10 million. A year or so later, Roy declared in interviews that he would never fight Dariusz unless he received at least $12 million. Later on, he said the Dariusz fight would not happen unless he got somewhere around $20-25 million, which is just absurd.

I won't oversimplify things by simply claiming "Roy ducked him," and I won't defend Dariusz's actions in this matter either. But even by his own admission, Roy did his part to prevent the fight from happening, and he has to shoulder at least part of the blame for the fight not happening IMO. The fact that he would intentionally set obstacles in the way of the fight shows that he was, at best, indifferent to making the fight. I agree with sweet scientist, that a fighter proves he's the best by pursuing these kinds of fights under difficult circumstances and triumphing. Roy's outlook on making this fight was the polar opposite of what fighters do to secure their legacies.

 

Never seen these before. Thanks! :good