michael moorer vs frank bruno

He looked rather aweful in the first Holyfield fight. He didn't even know how to clinch when he was in trouble. The only good moments he had were in the fifth round when Holyfield wanted to prove he could take Stewart's best and stood there trading with him, giving Alex a chance to land some bombs, and even by then Stewart was already a bloody mess. Alex improved later on as seen in the Foreman fight but never really established true contendership.

Fair enough. I had Foreman winning by perhaps a point or two, largely because he did have Stewart down twice which carries a lot of weight in only a 10 rounder ( Harold Letterman said the same thing. ) But frankly I think the site of George's disfigured face misled a lot of people into feeling Stewart hands down won. Not really the case if one actually watches the match from start to finish.

And how many prime and decent heavy's did Moorer beat? How good did he look against them?

Yes and no.. The experience certainly might have helped him before taking the huge leap from tomato cans to the elite. But the flip side of that coin is that maybe he never had the potential to begin with and a crafty veteran like a Coetzee or aged Bugner might have derailed him, completely thwarting his chances of ever getting the lucrative fights that he actually got. At any rate I have Bruno vs Moorer being about a 50/50 proposition. I think Moorer certainly could have beaten him, but I'm surprised at how some have picked MM with such conviction. He was a very hitable opponent with a shaky chin who was exposed by lesser men and who's resume aside from barely decisioning a poorly prepared Holyfield isn't much better than Bruno's if even at all.

 

Holyfield would have done the same to Frank Bruno, especially the inexperienced version who was KO'd by Smith, for example.
Bruno gets just about ALL his credit for valiantly getting beaten up and KO'd by top fighters. He also had a problem with clinching when in trouble.
He learned to clinch a bit by the time he faced Tyson, and lasted into the 5th round, hardly remarkable.

But anyway, I do think Michael Moorer was a cut above Bruno.

What do you mean exposed by lesser men ?

 

Except Moorer wasn't "inexperienced" when an aged Holyfield lambasted the shlt out of him. He was a veteran of 40 fights, a two time world champion, and still in his late twenties and prime.

Exactly, He gave fits to prime versions of Lewis, Witherspoon, and even gave Tyson some trouble briefly when Mike had KO'd spinks in his last fight.. Moorer got KTFO by a 45 year old Foreman who was off for a year and a half.

He had better survival skills than Stewart did and I can't believe you'd even venture to dispute it.. Swap out Bruno in 1993 and put Stewart in his place against Lennox. That fight would end before a fan had a chance to go take a ****.

And that's fine. I've already conceded that he could win. And his resume is a bit better too. But this is a head to head argument and a collosal puncher who showed grit against he elite could certainly score a knockout over a former light heavy who had **** defense and who's chin was exposed plenty.

- He was down twice and very nearly KO'd by Bert Cooper.
- He was decked and looked terrible against Everett "bigfoot" Martin
- He was less than impressive against Mike White
- He was arguably losing to Frans Botha until finally finishing him in the closing seconds of a 12 round fight.
- He was KO'd by a 45 year old Foreman who had fought only once in 22 months and was coming off a loss.
- He was KO'd in only one round by David Tua while being roughly around the same age that Bruno was when he lifted the title off of McCall

Looking at these results one can't help but think that Bruno might have done as well or better than SOME of these men. Then again he might not have. But I can't believe people are completely writing off Bruno as being an automatic "W" or worse yet, an easy fight.. I'm beginning to wonder if people around here were even watching Moorer fight back in the 90's..

 

I thought we were talking about Stewart's first fight with Holyfield, not Moorer.

I'm not sure Moorer was prime condition in 1997 anyway, but again, Holyfield would have beaten up ANY version of Bruno quite severely, imo.
Holyfield also beat the utter sh!t out of Mike Tyson around that time too.

Witherspoon was fat overweight against Bruno, not the primest version, imo. Most people say Lewis was not at his best in 1993 too, but yes you could call him prime.

I don't think a fat Witherspoon was better than the best version of Michael Moorer.

I would pick Foreman to KO Bruno too.

I did not venture to dispute it.
Bruno had better survival skills than Stewart.
I've stated pages ago that Bruno would last longer against Moorer than Stewart did.


Besides, there wasn't much admirable or remarkable in the way Bruno hung on to Tyson's neck and prolonged his time in the ring with him all the way into the 5th or 3rd rounds, in my opinion. I mean, relative to how good you rate a fighter, his particular demonstration of "survival skill" doesn't really register much.
But, yes, he was better at that than Stewart.

In your opinion.

The Lewis-Bruno fight on Lewis's record was sandwiched between Lewis being taken the full 12 by an over-the-hill Tony Tucker, and being extended into the 8th round by Phil Jackson.

Stewart went the distance with Foreman and Holyfield around the same time, so you're asking more from Lewis than I'd bank on personally. Based on examining the results.

He was exposed as a man who often got off the floor to win.
Bruno, to the contrary, was a notorious front runner.

Bruno was a better disciplined, conditioned fighter than Moorer, and had some very carefully orchestrated 'comebacks'. I don't think comparing the ages of them against Tua and McCall means much.

I don't think anyone has written off Bruno completely and certainly it wouldn't be an "easy fight" for Moorer.
I saw more posts in this thread suggesting an easy quick win for Bruno. And almost all the early posts seemed to have Moorer the loser. But perhaps both our perceptions are skewed regarding who has written what in this thread.

I'd expect Moorer to win, by KO, perhaps in 7 or 8 rounds.
Sure, Bruno has a chance to KO Moorer, a much better chance than he had against Tyson for sure.

 

I saw most of Bruno's fights from ringside,can't remember off the top of my head which if any southpaws he faced.The shot for the south paw is the right hand and Bruno had a heavy one.
I give him a small advantage here.

 

I was responding to your comment below:

And I simply replied by pointing out that Moorer wasn't inexperienced when an aged Holyfield lambasted him as the green version of Bruno was when he fought smith.

He was 29 years old and holding a title, but in any even he was better off than Holyfield was in their first meeting a few years earlier.

What does that have to do with the cost of bacon? Holyfield never faced the late 80's version of Tyson as Bruno did and Moorer never faced him period.

I'd pick Witherspoon to beat Moorer and on the right night give Evander fits.

What was the "best" version of Moorer? The one who got KO'd be a semi retired 45 year old Foreman? The one who got decked and barely beat Everett Martin or the one who fought at 175? I really don't know.

in 1990 I'd agree with you.. But In 1994 after he'd been schooled by the Duke, took a beating from Stewart, and would soon be gifted against Schulz? Not so sure.

Agreed. It was woeful the way he rabbit punched while holding. But I don't think Moorer or Stewart would have given a prime Tyson five rounds regardless of what they did. And you're only mentioning Tyson and not the other 3 opponents who needed come from behind wins to beat him.

Holyfield was coming off a loss to Bowe and had only fought once in the previous year, was past his prime and not particularly known for putting most guys away early anyway.. So I don't see the relevance in the comparison. Foreman had been just as inactive and would lose to Morrison in next fight since you're using performances that are close in proximity time wise... Can we also ad that Lewis had destroyed Ruddock in two rounds the previous fall?

Who did he get off the floor to beat? Bert Cooper? Everett Martin? A sick Holyfield with a bum shoulder and a heart problem? What happened when he finally went down against someone who could KEEP him there?

Think about what you just said in that paragraph. You conceded that Bruno was better disciplined and conditioned while also dismissing that he beat a world title holder at around the same age that Moorer was when losing in one round to a fringe contender.

I think most people have picked Moorer to win in this thread and its not a pick that I'm disputing entirely. The reasoning behind some of the arguments is pretty dogmatic and simplified however.

Fair enough.

 

I agree. If Bruno comes out and attacks straight away, I think he smotes Moorer. Similar to the way Tua did, except it might take a minute longer.

 

This is a tough call, Moorer was world class and won many a battle, victories over Stewart, Cooper, Holyfield, Schultz, Botha and Jirov prove he was up there and only fell short of the highest order. Bruno although good at European level was woeful at world level and always crumbled when facing the top tier opponents and i think he would do with Moorer.
I see Bruno struggling right from the offing due to Moorer's south paw stance which would negate his jab and give him trouble almost immediately. He may rock Moorer and possibly drop him but Frank always struggled to follow up and land more than one shot and i reckon Moorer comes through it relatively unscathed to stop Frank fairly early. Moorer KO 6 Bruno.

 

But you can make a case that although Tyson beat the **** out of Bruno twice, it was Bruno who put on a much better effort vs Lewis than Tyson did.

That same logic could very easily apply to an Holyfield Bruno scenario.

 

Moorer by UD. He is the more skilled fighter

 

Moorer stops Bruno in about 8 rounds, simply a higher class fighter. Moorer was a top 4 HW for a period of about 8 years in the 90s decade. Bruno was just one of those guys who got destroyed every time he stepped up to top world level.

 

Agreed, what is this elevation of Bruno lately, Moorer was twice the boxer and fighter.

 

Tough fight. Could go either way. I anticipate an exiting exchange of knockdowns. Be interesting to see how frank does against a quality southpaw

 

This would be an exciting fight, and a fight you would make in the hope Bruno could earn a win over a real World champion. But it’s Frank Bruno, the guy that had trouble winning the big fights and this would be a big fight. This could play out similar to this >

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Moorer stops Frank.