Michael Moorer vs. Ken Norton

No it was a good scrap, just that Moorer fought stupid, kind of down to Bothas sloppy level and got caught pretty good in the 11th if I recall correctly, instead of using his superior skill.
Not that Im downplaying Botha who is a fighter with decent skills, just that Moorer always seemed to be lagging behind at heavyweight. He could blast out a smaller guy, but he wasnt the monster at heavy he was at light heavyweight and I think some it had to do with his chin but alot had to do with Teddy Atlas.

 

And rightfully so. Going in with the clear intention of banging people out as he did at light-heavy would've seen him beaten before Foreman got there. The guy wasn't built very tough, physically or mentally. He could be hurt and mentally he's one of the worst fighters I've ever seen.

Although an ego maniac, doing what Atlas did may have been the only way to motivate the guy. And that didn't work either.

Moorer was too stubborn. He felt he needed to be proud from what I can see, and felt he should be a Warrior, even if he shouldn't have been one. He would've got sparked against someone he couldn't have held off, but could've limited his failures by using his natural talents, southpaw stance and fast combos to stun his opponent before turning them, re-setting and doing it again. He allowed himself to be in front all too often, and whilst I'd favour over some of the more vulnerable or smaller Heavys, someone like Tua is always going to get to him, whether Moorer is having the best night of his life or not.

 

You were typing as I was and making a similar point

You say Atlas turning him away from being a Monster is a bad thing. I think it was necessary, but Moorer was a fighter with inherent limitations. I.e he basically fulfilled his full potential as we see his career now; never going to be an ATG, although a damn good fighter and I would favour him against certain well regarded fighters.

 

Like someone said he had an excellent right jab and one of the few heavies that could hook off it, maybe Wlads a bit better, but Moorer stood right there in front and tried to block and counter and he just made himself more of an easy target with his bad chin and less offense. Its almost like he got lazier as a heavyweight.
Teddy knew this so he tried to keep him turning his opponents and moving to avoid getting hit cleanly, but he would just stand there and shuffle forward, which was a death sentence against a big hitter like Tua who you mentioned?
I remember they announced that fight, and I was thinking what the hell is Moorer going to do to Tua?? He cant box from the outside or move well enough to keep Tua off of him. I think he threw one or two punches and was stuck right in Tuas firing range and down he went. You cant ear muff and cover up right in front of Tua.
Moorer would have gotten killed by big offensive fighters but he did pretty well overall for being a small heavyweight and thats why I think he would have a shot against Norton. Yes agree he fulfilled his heavyweight potential.

 

Thats' exactly what I said, and exactly why I think Atlas was doing the right thing. You keep saying 'Atlas' fault' but surely it's Moorers fault for not sticking to an intelligent gameplan designed to prevent him getting starched?:huh

 

I only said he made him more complacent, but as you said he was giving him the proper advice to suit his lower output, just Moorer didnt listen. Were in complete agreement on that.:good
He could never fight that way at heavyweight

 

I thought we were mateYou know what I'm like, easily confused when I'm a bit:smoke

 

No problem bud, (no pun intended). I will say Teddy Atlas was a bit crazy. He was going to kill Donny Lalonde for firing him and actually went to his house with a gun. He beat up some press guy at the Botha Moorer fight and really just was way too overly dramatic and militant for most fighters to handle. I think he knew boxing, but he was just too emotional being in the corner if things didnt go the way he liked them to.
He almost tapped into a fighters insecurties too much, talking about their weaknesses in press conferences right in front of the fighter. Such was the case with Mike Grant.
I remember after the fight with Lennox Lewis, Atlas working his first fight with Grant said before the fight, We'll probably lose this fight because HBO doesnt allow for soft touches, and Jameel Mcline is not a fighter I want to put Grant in with coming off of such a big loss. So what happens? Grant gets starched in the first round. :blood

 

Yeah. he was overtly negative. Maybe he felt they would try and prove him right? He's training Povetkin now.

 

Norton by KO. Norton had a great right and Moorer was vulnerable to the right. Moorer had some good speed and that soutpaw edge, so it is possible that he takes Kenny out, but I see Ken's great condition, strength, right hand, greater activity catching up with Michael.

 

One of history's laziest boxers against one of its hardest working swarmers? Not sure Moorer has the power and consistent execution to keep Norton off of him for very long, but he might sneak in a good punch and hurt him a few times. Still, I think Ken can take his best and force a stoppage in the middle rounds.

 

I like Norton's hook to the body and lead overhand right to carry him to a late stoppage win against this southpaw. Ken was a really smart boxer, and would have understood how to tackle a lefty like Moorer. I think Michael would be the one more likely confused here, when he discovered that his southpaw orientation posed no particular difficulties for Kenny.

 

I think Moorer was a bit lazy at LHW as well. He knew he had power and relied on it, but it couldn't win him every fight at HW.

He would have a big chance against Norton early but it would likely be a 50-50 shootout or even the advantage for Norton who was very good at picking his punches and covering up while having his man against the ropes, more so than Alex Stewart or Bert Cooper. If it goes beyond the early rounds, it'd be Norton's fight. His strength and conditioning would be telling.

The best way to beat Norton is to pressure him backwards and trap him against the ropes but Moorer wasn't the man to do it.