Liston murders the sweetboy Tyson. He ain't no fookin old lady in an elevator or terrified lightheavy. Name one fight Tyson won where hecwas evenly matched and had to have heart and toughness to win. You can't. Tyson was a pure Sissy boy compared to Sonny.
A punk. A front runner. In a tough battle where the flak is flying once more Tyson would find a place to fall. Hahaha could you imagine what Sonny would due to the soft punk tyson if Mikey bit Sonny? Murder baby.
No 212 lb, 1 punch at a time, occassionally throws a combination, stationary fighter would have beaten a young Tyson. I stand by my statement unless a sensible argument changes my mind....Michael Spinks would be competitive with Liston. Lesser skilled, smaller fighters were. There's no reason why Michael Spinks wouldn't.
If Liston took Big Cat's shots for 2 fights, he is taking Tyson's. And Liston WOULD hurt Tyson. Liston had a telephone poll jab and that is Tyson's ultimate nightmare, gettin' stopped from coming forward. KO for Liston
. Hero worship is hard to argue with. You have the Cooney looneys. The Bruno Battalion. The Tyson is perfect even though history tells us different.
really? But yet name calling is something your hero Sweet Mike did throughout his career. Kind of hypocritical aren't you
Why is it when someone says Tyson beats fighter X, then said person is a "Tyson fanboy" or Tyson is "their hero"? But if someone says Liston, Ali, Holmes, Bonavena, Henry Cooper, Cleveland Williams etc they aren't a "Liston, Ali, Holmes, Bonavena, Cooper, Williams fanboy" or aren't accused of idolizing them? Name calling is just a way to dismiss any arguments because you don't have any counter arguments. This thread was supposed to be about Spinks vs Liston. And the only reason you picked against Spinks was to discredit Tyson in a round about way. Despite the fact that besides Ali, Michael Spinks probably would have been the best opponent he faced and not only that was larger at HW than most of the fighters who Liston beat or fought. No one is saying Liston couldn't beat Spinks, but Spinks would have a very live chance. And as I said, Michael Spinks at HW would probably have been more formidable than Machen and bigger, too.
I'm not that convinced by Spinks above 175, really. Went 2-0 against Holmes, but he was pretty fortunate to get the second verdict and this was a Larry who was really on the slide now, needing a lucky turn from the judges against Williams, struggling with an inexperienced Witherspoon and looking ragged against Bey. He then took on two pretty soft options in Tangstad and Cooney (a crime considering the other fights available at Heavy at the time) before getting wiped out by Tyson. I think a key point to consider here is that Spinks looked like a defeated man even before the first bell had rung against Tyson. One of the gold standard Light-Heavyweights, but above 175 I don't think Spinks was anywhere near the same, be it physically or mentally. Liston makes short work of him, for me. KO inside four rounds.
I picked against Spinks because he would be slaughtered. You said the Tyson of the Spinks fight would ko Machen in one. Spinks was terrified! Tyson was never like he was against Spinks . You want to build Spinks up to make your hero a great conqueror of a very good heavy. Spinks was not thus. Liston would pulverize Spinks and Tyson. Liston was the real deal baby. It took primetime Ali to beat Sonny! Wake up and learn man.
Yeah, like Liston pulverized Machen who staggered him with a left hook or was rocked by Folley while standing toe to toe with him. And I never said Spinks beats Liston, just that he has a better chance than the 190ish pound fighter that took Prime Liston the distance. A 190ish pound fighter that was then outboxed by the then current light heavy champion, who didn't bother to bulk up to 200+ pounds. Johnson weighed 181 pounds when he beat Machen at HW. And a 1988 Tyson would have disposed of Machen in 1 round. I don't see how anyone can plausibly argue against that. You're making it seem like since Tyson, who was much faster and better at cutting off a ring than Liston, beat Spinks in 1, so would Liston. So why can Machen survive the distance with prime Liston but a 200+ lb Michael Spinks can't? Besides your dislike of Tyson?
Yeah but a lesser skilled and smaller I might add, boxer and mover in Machen lost, but went the distance. You have to keep in mind that the heavies that Liston fought, for the most part were 200 and under pound fighters who stood in front of him. Of course, if Spinks stands in front of Liston, sure, he gets blasted out. But why would he do that? Like Machen, he'd be on the move. And by the modern standards of today, Machen would be a cruiser and with day before weigh ins, maybe even a light heavy. Or perhaps fight at both weights. And Liston wasn't as adept at ring cutting or anywhere near the foot and handspeed of a 1988 Tyson. And he wasn't a nonstop punching pressure fighter like Fraizer or Marciano. Liston may eventually find the KO or he may not, but it'd take some doing.
I'll ask what I asked everyone else. Why can Machen last the distance and not a HW Spinks? Especially since Spinks was likely more H2H skilled than Machen?
