Middleweight greats v Light heavyweight greats of the 70's and 80's

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Rodrigo Boom, Jul 14, 2023.


  1. Rodrigo Boom

    Rodrigo Boom Member Full Member

    127
    116
    Jul 14, 2023
    I recently read a post about what would have happened had Marvin Hagler moved up in weight to fight the great light heavyweights of the time and the consensus view was not too good.

    It got me thinking, which great middleweights of all time would have fared the best against Eddie Mustafa Muhammad, Matthew Saad Muhammad, Dwight Muhammad Qawi and Michael Spinks? I have a couple of names but I wondered what everyone else's thoughts are and why.
     
  2. Blofeld

    Blofeld Active Member Full Member

    1,309
    1,644
    Sep 27, 2022

    Great question! Well we have examples in Harry Greb and Mickey Walker fighting much heavier guys in their careers with Greb of course beating Tunney so they may have a chance. Almost certainly against Eddie Mustafa Muhammad, hard to count out Matthew due to his lazarus like ability to rise from the dead with Qawi and Spinks being the trickiest proposition.

    We also have mythical fighters like Barbados Joe Walcott, who fought everyone from lightweight up to heavyweight and Sam Langford who I believe also came up from MW. I would find it hard to make a prediction as there is so little evidence of these guys but I think a fight between either of them and Qawi would be awesome!
     
  3. Rodrigo Boom

    Rodrigo Boom Member Full Member

    127
    116
    Jul 14, 2023
    I agree with your choices. I was thinking possibly Monzon and Hopkins out of the newer guys. I think Hopkins proved he could stay with the light heavyweights of his era but the 70s & 80s guys are a bit of a different proposition. Monzon I feel could have grown into the weight because of the size of his frame. I always thought he looked weight drained at middleweight. Perhaps he didn't want to take the gamble on moving up when he was still champion.

    Going back to the light heavyweights, I always wondered how good a fight between Matthew and Dwight would have been with the 77 version of Saad, who came back against Johnson. Before he had all the damage of the next 4 years!
     
    Stevie G, Blofeld, Jel and 1 other person like this.
  4. Richard M Murrieta

    Richard M Murrieta Now Deceased 2/4/25 Full Member

    22,635
    30,360
    Jul 16, 2019
    Great fighters like Carlos Monzon knew their limitations, he appeared content to remain as World Middleweight Champion for 7 years, 14 title defenses, retiring as champion. Sometimes cleaning out a division is prestigious in itself.
     
    Stevie G, Blofeld, Jel and 3 others like this.
  5. Blofeld

    Blofeld Active Member Full Member

    1,309
    1,644
    Sep 27, 2022
    Hopkins is obviously a great fighter but I see him being outworked by the guys you first mentioned. Just look at the torrent of punches between Johnson and Saad Muhammad in their two classics. I feel Bernard liked to sit back and pick apart and opponent but I am not sure he ever faced anyone with the punch output of these guys. Hopkins looked horrible against Calzaghe who had a similar level of punch rate. I rate Hopkins higher P4P overall but I feel that generation of light heavies were something special on a H2H basis. I just feel they get him out of his groove and while I doubt they stop him I think over 15 rounds he is outpointed by Saad Muhammad and Qwai. He could maybe stop Johnson.

    While it is very difficult to imagine anyone stopping Monzon I think there is a reason he didn't take on Bob Foster. However I do feel he could have beaten Galindez but John Conteh outworks him as he is both naturally bigger but also a slick boxer, unlike Victor who I think Carlos outboxes after a very tough fight. I think these were the various champs at the time Carlos was active. As far as Saad Muhammad, Qwai, Johnson etc again I just think they were all two strong and aggressive and could upset Carlos' rhythm. Carlos relied on his pacing, size at MW and outlasting his opponents. Against these guys he would not be stronger and they could all fight a full 15 rounds at fast pace. I even think Yaqui López could beat him, although out of those top contenders (and let's face it López would be a fine champ in any other era) I think Lopez and Galindez maybe the ones most likely to lose to him. Spinks is simply a cut above all the others as a technician and would be too much for Monzon and Hagler IMO.

    Matt and Dwight would have been awesome then and I do feel Matt could pull out a win in another epic!

    Btw I suppose we should also chuck Bob Fitzsimmons into the mix and of course Roy Jones and James Toney! Bob I simply don't know enough about and he doesn't look that great on film but one can't discount his accomplishments or his punch. Jones was out of this world at SMW but given the aggression and punching power of the 80s LHW mob, let alone Bob Foster I would be surprised if he didn't pick up at least a loss and possibly a stoppage loss although I think he could beat more conventional boxers like Conteh and he could pick apart Galindez and Johnson. Oddly I feel Toney could stand the best chance against all of them, even Spinks. He had a granite jaw, doesn't just rely on athleticism and has loads of old school tricks up his sleeve as well as a great ring IQ. A fight against Spinks would be a technical masterpiece.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2023
    Stevie G and Rodrigo Boom like this.
  6. Rodrigo Boom

    Rodrigo Boom Member Full Member

    127
    116
    Jul 14, 2023
    I suppose you are right about Monzon. He probably wouldn't be strong enough to bully any of the greats at 175. I think if you had the Hopkins that beat Trinidad at light heavyweight then he might have had a chance. He did fight in 2nd gear a lot as he got older, but possibly he couldn't fight hard for 15 against Saad or Qawi. Good call on Toney, I hadn't considered him. Calzaghe would probably be a good contest for any of them also, if he had his 25 year old hands!
     
    Blofeld and Stevie G like this.