Modern Era Appreciation

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by HolDat, Mar 20, 2021.

  1. Surrix

    Surrix Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Well, Wlad likes me as guy but he definitely was very boring style despite this was A level.
    Vitali was really different style and he was not boring to watch. Never.
    This is like to compare Briedis vs Dorticos. Briedis is heavily undervalued till today, damn heavily undervalued but he might be boring sometimes. Yeah, he might deliver brilliant level stuff to watch and might be very boring.
    His most boring fights still were less boring than most boring Wlad's fights not alone Octopuse.
    Dorticos NEVER EVER was boring to watch. He really needs more promotion efforts, dude might be really interesting to watch.
     
  2. Gatekeeper

    Gatekeeper Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Based on level of opposition and willingness to fight anyone then Pacquiao, Fury and maybe Usyk all the rest either have mostly poor resumes, avoid challenges (Bud, Spence) or have question marks regarding PED's, catchweights and questionable scorecards (Canelo).
     
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  3. Surrix

    Surrix Boxing Addict Full Member

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    There a lot boxers who did not had avoided challeges: even the same prime Briedis, to some extent Glowacki, Huck.
    U.S CW fighters: I appreciate Dorticos, Tabiti and Hunter.
     
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  4. Finkel

    Finkel Active Member Full Member

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    Primo Carnera was a sufferer of Gigantism and yet was Ring Champion back in the 30s. And still has the best KO record of any champion. Because he was just so much bigger than his peers (and potential mob influence) as he wasn't exactly light on his feet.

    And yet he would be small next to naturally big men in Fury and Joshua, though he would certainly have the weight advantage over Wilder. All three move around the ring a lot better than Primo.

    People might mock Joshua for getting put down repeatedly by Ruiz, but Ruiz is one of the heaviest champions ever and has very fast, heavy hands, and with that size he brings a chin.

    I actually posted an animation further down that shows just how much bigger+heavier the modern heavyweight division is compared to yesteryear.

    Most of the top heavies now would run rough shod over the majority of fighters pre 1970s.
     
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  5. Braindamage

    Braindamage Baby Face Beast Full Member

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    Primo Carnera got destroyed by a much smaller man too. I'm not saying the past era fighters would dominate today's fighters. But, it seems when mythical match ups are made, we tend to say the fighters from the past train a certain way, the techniques are ancient etc. My point is, the training would be equal if they fought, therefore, today's fighters will only have a size advantage. Which, as I mentioned, can be nullified, as Ruiz proved. Would the past era fighters have issues with the super sized guy of today, no doubt. I just don't think 100% of the time, today's fighters beat 100% of yester years greats.
     
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  6. Mickea4

    Mickea4 Member Full Member

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    I agree it's not a particularly strong division but its always had a couple of top guys occupying the "pole" positions; when you're sharing a division with GGG and canelo, you're never gonna be the top guy, and before them Martinez

    Aside from those guys, Jacobs probably beats every top middleweight of the last 25 years
     
  7. FrankinDallas

    FrankinDallas Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I've been watching boxing for a long time. This era has most physically trained boxers ever. By that I mean nutrition and diet as well as
    pre-fight training. Not talking about "trainers" like learning in-bout tricks of the trade; that may be a little further behind. Guys like Holyfield
    used good diet and new exercise techniques and YES I KNOW HE USED PEDS but that's not what I'm talking about.

    As far as boxing abilities are concerned, we have a much better world wide group of men to choose from. No longer are the USSR guys not permitted to fight so that has grown the sports popularity a lot.
     
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  8. El Gallo Negro

    El Gallo Negro Active Member banned Full Member

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    Winky Wright I think,
     
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  9. Lesion of Doom

    Lesion of Doom Well-Known Member Full Member

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    The Holmes era was awful, too. Until Tyson came along, that division had no life.

    My biggest gripe with today's fighters is they just don't fight often enough. Even as recently as Holmes, top fighters might have 3 fights per year rather than 1-2. Hell, Holmes himself fought four times in 1983. You're going to get lower quality bouts when that happens, but it's better than being on the shelf and *still* not fighting a top opponent in your yearly or twice-per-year fights.
     
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  10. Badbot

    Badbot I Am An Actual Pro. Full Member

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    Oh, absolutely.
    Size does matter, but at some point it´s still about style and skills.
    Quawi had a peculiar build and was extremely skilled. Thus he was able to thrive at LHW and Cruiser.
    Most guys with his build end up journeymen, if not just punching bags.

    Jess Willard was a giant for his time and he was a good boxer. But he still lost to much smaller guys who were just better than him.
    Exceptions to the rule exist, but it´s better to fight guys your own size and physical dimensions. Broner is a great example of this. He easily beat guys who were at a weight disadvantage. But once Broner moved up in weight, he failed to change his style and now keeps loosing fights. Anyone who has boxed slightly bigger guys knows that the angles and distance are a bit different, so there needs to be a change in tactics and style.
     
  11. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft 'Snarky Little Gobshite' - IntentionalButt Full Member

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    Definitely not. Hopkins schools him. I thought he lost to both Derevyanchenko and Rosado as well. Pirog always beats him. I'd take Pavlik, Wright and Taylor over him. Tall Paul also has a chance, but I'd favour Jacobs.
     
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  12. big_AL

    big_AL P4P #1 Full Member

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    It's the same in almost every sport, except perhaps American football: the athletes/fighters/players of the past eras would always whoop the current.

    In 30 years time, fans will be throwing similar hyperbole about how the 2050 P4P #1 wouldn't last 8 rounds against the likes of Pacquiao, Mayweather and Canelo and how GGG would walk down any MW around today etc etc

    Just the nature of sports
     
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  13. Mickea4

    Mickea4 Member Full Member

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    I also thought he lost to Derev & Rosado (although wasn't that at super middle?) I wouldn't fancy pavliks chances against Jacobs and Wright and Taylor I see maybe 60/40 in Jacobs favour, he's not always the better guy on the night (see Derev and Rosado) but on his night he's a force to be reckoned with , I also had him narrowly beating GGG even though I had money on GGG decision - but he doesn't get the respect he deserves mainly because he was never - and never could be, really - the best guy in his division. Compare that to some one like Fernando Vargas Who gets far more respect than Jacobs despite never being the number one in HIS divisions, gracias a De la Hoya , Trinidad etc , and it makes me think if Jacobs was around in a different era wed put a bit more respect on his name
     
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  14. Decker

    Decker Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I think part of the Wlad is boring is partly due to this bias we're discussing. No doubt Vitali was more excitng than his "little" brother.
    After the Terrell-Chuvalo fight, Ali called Terrell "the octopus" for the way he constantly clinched Chuvalo as he tried to get past Terrell's longer reach. The 2nd incarnation of Ali was a jab and grab master, like Wlad was. Except in a later era Wlad fought and defeated, often by T/KO much larger HWs. Probably soon after one of their fights, Ken Norton said "Ali has a new style, holding".

    If you take off the rose colored glasses, many of Ali's fights were boring. Except when he fought a top pressure fighter like Frazier or someone close to his size w/skill like Norton.
     
  15. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist Full Member

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    Bizarre comment. Jacobs came up with Canelo, GGG, and Pirog. BJS, Jermall, D-Chenko, Lee, and Quillin were a decent supporting cast. It's better than the second half of the 90s and first decade of the 2000s. Not enough fights got made, but Jacobs fought the top guys.

    I was practically ringside when he fought D-Chenko and everybody had Jacobs ahead.