More deserving of P4P top 10: Ward or Froch?

Ward but i think it should be remembered that styles make fights and Froch would always have a harder time with Kessler than Ward. However, if you must get bogged down in these ridiculous lists then why not just wait to see the final once Froch gets through Johnson the winner getting a top 10 p4p slot.

I Agree with whats been said about the 168 division atm, the best fighting the best in a stacked division its great to see. I would like to see Ward if he wins going down to 160 and giving Martinez a real test in that shallow division (or at a catchweight perphaps) after cleaning up and unifying. Dont see Froch getting down to 160 anytime soon though.

 

True, because Ward is more versatile. As good as Froch is (and he is, when the best fight the best it's not always the most flashy or technically able that prosper) Ward is clearly more able than him, that is just from watching him, you can see how classy he is, he can box, he can rough his opponent up, only thing I'm not 100% on is his ability to take a top-level punch, but then he is so quick not many will be able to exploit that. When the resume is close (and it is here) you have to go with who appears more rounded, and that is clearly Ward IMO.

Of the fight itself, Froch should get his licks in but he's a solid and unspectacular puncher IMO, and won't be able to land enough. He has the chin to absorb anything that Ward throws at him and will keep trying throughout, I actually think that is the fight that will really allow us to see the best of Ward.

If Froch wins, and I'll want him to if he gets past Johnson, it will be momentous! I just can't see it happening really, though I don't think he'll disgrace himself or look as ragged as the rest of Wards top-flight opposition have, he's too awkward, tough and he'll give Ward more to think about. Wards best bet is to do what he does so well and get in Frochys chest, he is limited on the inside other than grabbing round the back of the head and throwing arm punches. I think both men will look to mix up their approach though, and that Ward is just better at all aspects of boxing not to lose. It will be engaging, competitive, and the two best in the division proving who is the no.1

The winner getsto beat up Bute :yep

 

Agreed.

There's no excuse for it either, especially if the away fighter is a clear winner, which it sounds like Page was this weekend.

It just shows how for all the **** Fury gets that he's actually quite good.... Page wouldn't be a journeyman here, of that I'm certain.

I was a tad surprised that Maloney put Dallas in with him, if it was Price I'd have understood it. Maybe he saw how Fury handled him and thought he could make a bit of a statement with a stoppage?

Hopefully it leads to some of the domestic heavies getting put into some kind of pecking order.

 

Froch has a better win over Abraham, Ward has a better win over Kessler.

However, Froch holds wins over Dirrell (officially, but most would say otherwise), Pascal and Jermain Taylor before he was truly finished.

 

Ward took away all of Kesslers avenues of winning. When Frochs languid, awkward style and pace stunted Kesslers ability to judge distance, he cut inside and outpunched Carl, who then couldn't stop Kessler from clearly winning competitive rounds.

Ward shut Kessler down, Froch went to war and lost, because he had to. Ward is more versatile.

 

Footwork is one of if not the most important thing in high level boxing and thats why I can not see Froch beating a fighter like Ward. Footwork was why it was so easy for Froch to keep Abraham on the end of a jab, Abraham didn't have any. Footwork was why Ward could take Kessler's jab away. It's critical, Froch isn't going to land anything, his feet and hands are too slow. Ward will just smother him inside and outwork him up close, it won't be pretty but it won't be difficult for Ward either.

 

Ward clearly should be ranked higher with his win over Kessler. And the fact Froch clearly lost to the dane.

They both clearly beat Abraham.

If you factor the dodgy Dirrell decison then Carl only has one real win in the super six.

1-2 doesnt seem p4p worthy to me. When the only clear win is over a middleweight thats being used as a punching bag at 168 lbs.

 

If anything Ward has further demonstrated that Abraham is not a top tier SMW.

That takes the shine off Frochs win a little bit.

You could also mention that a significant number of people felt Dirrell should have been given the decision over Froch.


I have grown to like Froch over the last couple of years but he hasn't been as impressive as Ward in my opinion.

 

The Abraham that fought Ward looked...no, was far fitter and faster than the one who fought Froch.

 

yes.

 

I thought Froch did a better job on abraham, looks like Froch carries more authority in his punches. Abraham was competitive with ward early, landed some good jabs, and was never totally discouraged. Just outclassed. Abraham knew he couldn't throw caution to the wind with Froch though.

In terms of p4p then it's hard to call. Wards Kessler win is huge. But Froch against pascal is strong too and he deconstructed Abraham. Close one. Probably ward for his 0 and the Kessler win.

 

Nope he just looked it because Froch took his heart away, he mightve been slightly fitter on the night but he clearly respected Frochs shots alot more. If the fights had been the other way round i wouldntve been surprised if abrahams corner threw in the towel. I think if Abraham had opened up more and Froch didnt deviate from the game plan AA wouldve taken a brutal beating.

Im not saying this makes Froch better than Ward (i have ward the favourite) because Froch had the advantage of his range, size and power that were more valuable against Abraham than Wards skills in the same way Wards skills were more valuable against Kessler than Frochs.

Also i disagree with the idea that Froch HAD TO go to war with Kessler, he chose to (probably imo to make a statement in his constant comparison with calzaghe) and if the AA fight is anything to go by then that lost helped him realise he needs to use his skills not just his chin and power to win. So that Froch is a different beast to the one that fought Kessler.

For the record i think in a rematch Froch beats Kessler more convincingly than Kessler beat Froch.

 

Of course, Froch wins a rematch, it was all the fault of the volcanic ash and his gameplan. It's scary the amount of delusion that surrounds that loss from people on here and Froch himself. He was getting pushed back all night and heres a fighter trades on his strength and toughness. Kessler was simply stronger than him and had more desire on the night.

 

This will be sorted out soon, don't stress yourself mate, at least in super 6 they could fight each other.

 

:rofl Im not saying volcanic ash has anything to do with the result of the first fight, although problems in the weeks before a fight can have a big affect on a fighter and its the job of a champ to get over those kind of issues.

Froch lost that fight BECAUSE he got into a battle using just his strength and toughness without using his boxing skills to full extent. Im not saying he wouldve definitely won if hed used different tactics but those clearly werent the ones to employ. Furthermore, like you said Kessler had more desire on that night i think another 12 rounds with a smarter fighting Froch if he starts landing early will drain that desire from him fast.