More Punching Power? David Tua or Rocky Marciano

"Yeah now you can name all the experts that agree with you."

Try and keep up.

 

Marciano's KO power seemed to come from hitting people in the right area and with an accumulation of punches.

Tua definitely has more one punch power. His left hook is really one of the most brutal punches in history. It may be the hardest single punch ever seen in boxing.

 

But by that logic you're committing the same logical fallacy, to the extent that you value Abe Simon's expert opinion as conclusive and ignore all other evidence. Nothing illogical or insensible about referring to a near-consensus of respected experts, especially in rebuttal of an argument based on the anomalous opinion of one lone expert.

 

No I'm valuing Abe's observation. He was the one being hit by both fighters. It's funny how you internet boxers try telling the fighters who hit them the hardest lmao "Uhh Mr. Muhammad Ali that's incorrect Shavers couldn't have hit you the hardest he's only 210 lbs"

McVey said I was wrong because a so called "expert" didn't agree with me. That's the ****ing definition of argument by authority lol

 

The thing about Marciano was he was always in such tremendous physical condition that he could throw those power shots all through a fight. Marciano was never a very accurate puncher , ["he used to swing so wild ,that was like sending me a letter " ]Ted Lowry, but he was a relentless one.

 

Whether Simon has a firsthand observation or not, his commentary is still just one man's opinion and your over-reliance upon it is still an appeal to authority. "Abe Simon thinks that Walcott hit harder, so it must be true that Walcott hit harder."

Classic boxing fans put way too much stock in these things because these types of quotes: (1) are impossible to disprove completely due to the unavailability of objective evidence; and (2) add to the mystique and folklore of the sport that classic fans seem to love so much.

It should be clear to any sensible observer that even the most experienced fighters and fight people at times have idiosyncratic, implausible views about many topics--including their own firsthand experiences.

 

I've read other accounts that Walcott hit harder than Joe I just can't recall them right now. That factors in quite a bit. Also Marciano said that Walcott hit him the hardest so he clearly was a very hard hitter. I never said or implied "Abe Simon thinks that Walcott hit harder, so it must be true that Walcott hit harder" I said that Walcott hit harder than Joe citing an one piece of evidence as Abe Simon's testimony. Even if it was only Simon's testimony with nobody else saying anything to the contrary then it would still be enough to say Walcott hits harder. It's incredibly far fetched to think that there is a large varience in Joe Louis and Jersey Joe Walcott's power from fight to fight.

My use of Abe Simon's testimony is not an appeal to authority. This is a concept that requires first hand observation. That observation is being hit by the fighters. If the facts were in your favor you would not be calling it an appeal to authority.

Mystique and folklore? It's just punching power dude. It's cool and all but it's not magic. You and quite a few other posters are the ones so adamant on making power seem like such a big deal when in reality it's not all that.

 

And like I just wrote, this is exactly where we disagree.

If you uncritically embraced everything every boxer tells you about their opponents, you'd end up spouting some pretty wacky views:

https://www.boxingforum24.com/threads/least-believable-best-ive-faced-answers.596029/

BTW, what was Abe Simon's quote exactly?

 

Actually i agree with Dagowop. Bigger Bags do help with power. But punchers are born not made. Youre not gonna turn a featherfisted guy into Julian jackson just by getting him a really big bag. It helps a bit but there is a limit to how much you can improve upon your natural power once you get in shape and learn proper punch technique. Its actually much more time effective to work on timing and accuracy if you want to make your punches more effective.

 

I doubt that (at least I hope you're wrong). I've always argued that we should trust our own eyes and brains, and draw our own inferences based on all of the available evidence, rather than relying upon surprising quotes from individual fighters and fight people. I completely understand why people might disagree with me, but I think I've been pretty consistent here.

 

If Golovkin hits that hard then he should move to 175 or maybe even HW. After all he manhandled Andy Ruiz which Parker a top 5 HW couldnt do. He would have a speed advantage over most HWs too! Also a better boxer than almost anyone except prime tyson fury maybe so GGG should just go ahead and grab himself a heavyweight belt huh?

 

Don C*ckell said several of his opponents hit harder than Marciano but none so often.
Archie Moore said Yvon Durelle and Curtess Sheppard hit him harder than Rocky does that mean that Durelle and Sheppard were harder punchers? Louis stopped Simon twice, Walcott was knocked out by Simon and couldn't even floor him.

 

An interesting premise.

Could Golovkin fight at heavyweight?

He would have to weigh at least 193lbs in order to get the fight sanctioned, and this would be difficult for him to do effectively.

It is no implausible that he could have been a Mickey Walker type heavyweight contender back in the day.

 

I think it was "Walcott hit me harder than Louis did."

Who else would have a better idea of who hit harder than Simon? Seeing as he was hit by both.

 

I'd favor GGG over Ruiz if they fought. Regardless of how much GGG weighed. He's stronger, smarter, faster, a better puncher, even boxes better. Reach would be almost the same.