More tragic downfall: Roy Jones Jr. or Naseem Hamed?

But reflexes are largely genetic-at least their limits.
A tiny percentage of people could develop them like Jones did.
Some dominant pro athletes are even able to some degree skate by on natural abilities-not all work extremely hard.
With Jones it is a combination, but without natural gifts he never would have been near a great.

I asked if you have a sports background-like an actual Journeyman?

 

One of Barrera’s best wins came against Kennedy McKinney, who also fought Bungu. Do you know what happened in these fights?

 

Wow, I think about this quite differently than most of you. That being said, tragic is a bit of an overly strong word for this subject. I'm not sure either situation is tragic.

Hamed was a supremely confident, highly egotistical boxer with very good skills and a powerful punch. He beat a slew of good fighters then lost once to Barrera. After that he lost his desire to fight and his swagger. In boxing terms, the effect of that fight was tragic.

For me the post-prime part of RJJ career was a bit sad to see greatness reduced but I don't see it as tragic. His situation wasn't like Ray Robinson who had to keep fighting to pay his bills. Jones had money, he just enjoyed the sport and was doing what he liked.

 

Roy

He was the p4p top dog that nobody could get remotely near. Then the wheels fell off and he started getting KO'd.... stayed in the game too long fighting guys who wouldn't have laid a glove on him in his pomp.

 

I think you are of little faith, You are making a lot of assumptions. Boxing isn't an activity like sprinting or weightlifting.

 

I am showing no lack of faith in the ability of people to develop skills.
What are my assumptions? Just that in any ability there is a bell curve of potential, often represeneted by standard deviations from the mean.
There are large differences between boxing & pure speed & strength-but reflexes are a component core ability that like explosive speed & power can, like natural punching ability, be maximized, but how much you can develop if largely genetic.

Someone boxing from very young will tend to be better due to all the hours dedicated & how much you are imprinted young.
But Jones & huge punchers or guys that can throw ~ 100 mph are mostly natural, otliar phenomena-even other talented boxers starting young do not get such preternatural response times.
Less so those in the more average range, me the vast majority of human beings.

 

Surely that would mean Hamed was the more tragic case? Because he was supposed to become the best and greatest fighter ever, and didn’t come remotely close.

Jones overachieved. He didn’t stand out as any better than Liles, Littles or McClellan in 1988 for instance; they all appeared equally as good as each other.

 

I don't see either as tragic really.
Naz had that one loss, then after a win was gone.
Yes, Jones slide down the pole was sad. But there's hundreds of story's like that. The tragic ones are The G man, michael Watson, Young Ali against McGuigan, Jimmy Doyle against Ray Robinson, Benny Paret, Davy Moore, Johnny Owen and so many more.

 

Hamed's downfall was more of a celebration than anything tragic. God bless Barrera.

 

This. At least the fight part.

 

and people forget that the kelley fight was a freaking barn burnet of a fight!

 

Tragic ? See Benny Lynch or Jackie Patterson or Jim Driscoll for the definition of tragic. Neither of the two you've mentioned were broke, murdered or died early.
Some might suggest one of them was a bully and hype job too.

 

Naseem since Roy established his greatness before his downfall and Naseem was just coming on his.

 

Naz looking fatter than ever now.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/18589172/prince-naseem-hamed-house-queen-windsor-castle/