Most confusing fact in classic boxing history

How is it possible that 19-year-old George Foreman becomes an Olympic champion with less than 20 fights under his belt and having been boxing for several months?
Francis Ngannou, a 37-year-old MMA fighter who is inactive due to a serious injury, gives the heavyweight linear champion such a difficult fight in his boxing debut that one judge predicts he will win.

How could such bull**** as Ali vs Anoki happen??

 

Allow me sir

Talent and lots of it!

Fury has very little depth of character and trained like it.

MONEY

 

For me… it’s Ali showing symptoms of brain damage in exile, his speech was also notably off as early as 71 - any neurological distress would put your timing and senses off I’m positive so in this game of milliseconds he beat everybody in a good era as a damaged fighter in decline.

 

anyone ever having 300+ fights is confusing.

 

Greb, Tunney, and Dempsey have such a mystique it is nearly if not impossible to write or report anything honest about them without drawing the ire of the entire boxing world. Greb's far more suspect than anyone wants to admit. As long as any newspaper reported it, it shows up on Greb's record. No other boxer gets this treatment.

Are you sure it's not part of the Don Dunphy collection? Radio was the more popular choice back then because most people would not have TVs until the later 50s and 60s. There's a lot no filmed that was recorded. It's not a bad listen either. Though, I don't remember if Charles-Moore is.

He was white.

He's Latino.

 

For myself

Fans


fans are the most confusing.


Y'all all know about the racism but choose to uphold it and even defer to the white ducker for benefit of doubt.

Y'all are fully aware the commies didn't even start boxing until about 2000, blacks could not be champions until the 30s, and sanctioning bodies were unimportant until the 20s, but don't anyone dare claim champions prior to the 90s, 30s, or 20s were not "world" level champions. Including Sullivan.

Y'all are fully aware it is the fighters themselves that seek easy fights, big pay days, and belts with no historical significance but absolutely refuse to blame boxers for the corruption in the sport like as it is even possible for promoters or bodies to be the source of their own corruption. You demonize Don King for giving us cheap fights featuring prime top champions "because him screwed duh boxers doe" and praise Lewis for giving us regular belts or Larry Holmes for lowering the status of the belts both of which were just ducking for money but should be praised because "but him great fighter doe"


The fans' absolute inability to hold any fighter accountable is mind-numbing.

 

Bro, I'm a fan too. Just as guilty as anyone.

Fair point, modern ams should be looked at more closely and compared more often with older eras early careers. Because, yeah, they had a lot of fights in the past. Hell, even the 49-0 is starting to look like a fat record. But they had like no am fights. Combine modern fighters ams with their pro and you have record more similar to the old days. Usyk, on boxrec, all bouts, is 111-12. Looks like a mid 20s multiweight ATG record.

I guess it is but you know I meant 1920s not 2020s.


More to the point though, I dropped three points in history I think are fair cut off lines but I myself don't feel strongly about any of the three. The 90s does seem a bit late in the game to call it global, especially if one is going to compare all bouts. Like you say, they did compete in amateurs. That is not terribly dissimilar to how black men could fight white men, just not for titles. However, the scope of communism compared to the scope of race, I could see why one would say it is simply not a big enough demographic to make commies turning pro the point when boxing globalized.

For the end of the colorline; while the demographics are definitely there the scope of the sanctioning bodies may not be. The truth is they claimed world governing like how the pioneers claimed it, long before they had the actual ability to actually govern anything near being considered the planet. Boxing just after the end of the color line may feature black fighters, but they are mostly Americans and British with a sprinkle of former colonies and the rare defector. So while I can understand the 90s might be a bit late the 30s-80s seems maybe a bit early. though, imo, both have merit and are respectable.

I do think the 20s sanction bodies is a fair mark in history to say this is when boxing globalized but it still has the race and scope issue so it is easily argued against. The entire point though is this is when boxing isn't just giving lip service, it is actually trying to be a global sport. Prior to the 1920s is nothing but a history of claims and consensus between America and England. Sure you can be Irish or Australian or Canadian or whatever and be a champion but the "world" champions are the ones the Americans and English have consensus on and absolutely no one gives a **** what a place like Mexico has to say. The 20s at least ends claim era and begins the earned era. Again, but in the light of racial tensions and the lack of reach, accepting all nations as equal may not be enough.

I have no real reason, other than everyone else does it, to respect any of the pre-body champions on the world level. They are in all reality the champions of the whites of America and the British Empire exclusively. Corbett, Fitzs, Jeffries, Burns, Johnson, all ATGs, all men I respect a lot. None of them are really world champions. I can't for the life of me see John L Sullivan as anything but the last and greatest bare knuckle champion. He's not even a QB champion imo. He's a QB advocate, sure, but the vast majority of his fights are mixed rules at best using whatever gloves they wanted if any. Hardly anyone on the planet boxed, of them he only needed to deal with the whites, somehow his BK credentials are his QB champion credentials because he needs only draw men to get titles.



That's a lot just to say, yeah, I do it too. I think probably the 60s change over from NBA to WBA and NYSAC+IBU+BBBoC to WBC is probably the most fair but I wouldn't argue with a guy who strongly believes the commie addition to pros is very important and made a huge impact. Because it's kind of true.

 

What's confusing to me is You preaching about racism, yet choose to use a vernacular that seemed to be a little racist.
And conviently right after you used a person of color for your rant. ( Don King, Larry Holmes,)
Sometimes the sub conscious speaks volumes about what we truly feel inside.
Many Americans fighters fought all over the World. Ray Robinson had a All European tour where he fought almost monthly the best the continent had to offer in their back yard.
Ali also fought in many different countries , as well as many other boxers. Are you suggesting they were not "World Champs" because of other countries political agenda?

Soviet Bloc countries( The countries you choose to call "Commies ", which is also a peak into your sub conscious) had amatuer boxing programs for years, going back to at least the 1930's.
Is it the world's fault they did not allow those boxers to turn pro? We don't know how well or not so well those fighters would've done in a pro setting, but we do have some clues by the ones that did make it into democratic countries. Most of them were just ok.
Most of the great Cuban fighters through out history went to America in order to use their talents for their own personal gain and opportunity, because of Cuba's political stance which was the culprit.
Not the fighters.
Most of the fans who actually love the sport itself, and not particular fighters , hold fighters accountable, many a fan on this very site have pointed out Larry Holmes not fighting the best fighters available during his era the last half of his career.
I've pointed it out few times myself, along with pointing out Mayweather Jr's smoke and mirrors second half of his career .
Maybe you read the wrong post?

 

Good call on Foreman! That he won a gold medal with that level of boxing experience is mind boggling! Add to that he was taking on fighters who had over 10 to 15 years experience and it's even greater.

 

Bro, TF are you even talking about?

Reread my post, I don't think you understood it. If you did this response is nothing short of ****ing weird buddy. Did you mean to make my point for me?

 

Monzon once killed a penguin in order to impress that girlfriend.