Muhammad Ali vs. George Foreman - the importance of fetching the ring

No.

Ali was capable of absorbing a lot of punishment, both upstairs and down.

The looser ropes made a difference, but not a significant difference.

Yes, he should have been ahead as he landed the cleaner, more effective shots.

He was even using righthand leads that baffled George.

Maybe you just don't know how to score it.

I Already explained to you why Ali was ahead.

I've already told you that Dunde was not aware, not in agreement with Ali's strategy.

Everything you've said here is your (unsupported) speculation. Conspiracy therory stuff.

How the **** should I know.

Maybe because Ali hadn't invented it yet.

Yes it was. foreman was not unbeatable and Ali was very good.

I've already said that the looser ropes had minimal effect on what went down.

Not too many about the first fight. Ali clearly took away Liston's gameplan with his speed and elusiveness and peppered him.

I've already answered that.

 

hmm and i wonder why ali never gave foreman a rematch

 

Hell no..ali had his number...he knew exactly how to beat him....prime ali will always beat a prime formane in my book...the fight proved this

 

You have psychic powers as well. You're amazing !

No sir. He came forward all right. And punched.

Right up till he got KO'd.

Well maybe I don't, so I'll have to be content with the fact that the majority of observers, including the judges, saw it the way I did. But don't let that stop you continuing to explore and expose reality.

Of course. I get it. Just because he was an unknown promoter with his first major fight, doesn't mean he didn't have everything arranged.

No. I can see you're a sharper cookie than all of those fools who don't have your perspicacity and insight.

(Could you maybe tell us who was really behind 9/11 ?)

That's nice.

Care to fill us in on some of the hidden 'truths' you've managed to expose ?

Well, well. Now we know how Ali managed to achieve such greatness. He was created by Don King and his pull with the judges.

Why haven't you enlightened us all on this before. We could have avoided a lot of debate and discussion if only we had your insight and understanding of reality available to us.

Yessir. If only Ali had stood and brawled with him instead of trying to outsmart and outbox him, George could have won.

****in' lowdown dirty shame.

Maybe future bouts should be conducted under the Marquis of Frankenfrank rules. Ali gets to take a shot at George. Then, if George is still standing, it's his turn. Then Ali again. And so on. Till one of them goes down.

They could flip a coin to see who gets first shot.

This would have been fairer to Baldomir and IMO, he wouldn't have been robbed agains Mayweather. Little ****er used strategy to take advantage of Carlos.

You sure did. You're a ****in' genius. You se the little things that escape everyone else.

Liston ?

You were doing fine up till there. Ali hadn't invented the rope-a-dope yet when he faced Liston. He had to dance and move and outbox the fearsome big man.

Still, it wasn't fair for him to keep hitting Sonny and then not letting Sonny hit him back. Not sporting.



I think you could be on to something here.

Future fights would be a lot fairer under your visionary new methods.

In fact, I think we could go back (to at least as far as good video existed) and rescore a fair number of bouts using your revolutionary insights.

This would be fairer to everybody concerned.


I see Floy'd '0' going. Calzaghe's too.

Maybe even Rocky's.

It's going to be a pain in the ass for Boxrec, but it's more important to 'get it right.'



I think I'm going to nominate you for Classic poster of the year.

 

Well, the fact remains that when one of them did fall, it wasn't Ali.

I don't completely dismiss the notion that Foreman may in fact have been drugged, but perhaps he always would have looked drugged against that version of Ali. Whether or not there's any merit at all to this claim, he certainly looked different than he had against Norton, Frazier, Chuvalo and Peralta. Where was his vaunted jab? What happened to the patient stalking of Norton? Maybe it's because his hand speed contrasted so poorly with Ali's, but his punches did look slower and more telegraphed than they did in previous showings.

Even if Foreman was genuinely feather fisted, Ali was never the type of puncher to typically attempt a two round knockout, certainly not against someone with the strength and chin of Foreman's. As it was though, the effectiveness of Muhammad's power came with startling quickness. George's face began showing wear almost immediately, and he was in significant distress as early as round four. All one really needed to do was look at their respective mugs to know who was doing all the effective scoring. Until Holmes, only Frazier and Bob Foster had made him look like he'd really been in a fight.

This wasn't his style anyway, and he actually played it fairly conservatively in waiting for the kill. Foreman didn't show me anything of significance after Ali taunted him following the delivery of George's Sunday Punch combination of a career in round five. By Foreman's own admission, he was essentially finished after that.

Ali went 12 rounds five consecutive times because he was a boxing stylist, first and foremost. Actually, the number of stoppage wins on his dossier is remarkable considering this. Stylistically, the acquired stamina and practice of pacing and endurance does usually give a mobile boxer a huge edge over a quick starting slugger, whether or not the boxer employs that mobility in such a showdown.

He withstood massive punishment in Manila, and against Norton and Shavers. All common opponents of Shavers and Foreman rated Earnie as the harder puncher. (For that matter, both Holmes and Tillis rated Shavers over Tyson in the power department as well.) There's nothing in Ali's history to suggest that Foreman would have done better with tighter ropes.

Foreman took substantial punishment from Holyfield, Moorer and Morrison, and Frazier did nail him with some good hooks in their rematch. It remains a fact that Ali was the first to bring him down, and for far more than a flash knockdown. He stopped Bonavena as the result of a single hook, and Lyle was unable to recover from that first big right hand Muhammad stunned him with. Had Tony Perez not waved it off at seven, Wepner would have been counted out for the only time in his career. Ali wore down and finished off Jerry Quarry with comparable dispatch in their 1972 rematch.

 

Tight ropes or not, Foreman (who's one of my favs) fought a stupid fight. He tired himself out.

 

Foreman has stated that Ali was the greatest HW of all time.

 

You are a hilarious poster.

 

If the ropes had been tighter Ali would simply have used another tactic. Every now and then a fighter is n't going to lose,no matter what. That applied to Joe Frazier in the FOTC. It also applied to Muhammad Ali in Zaire.