Muhammad Ali Vs. Lennox Lewis

If Norton can arguably beat 70's Ali twice Lewis certainly has a chance of beating him, stylistically Lewis is an awkward matchup for this Ali. Big, strong, hardhitting heavyweight who is a much better technician and ring general than Foreman. Rope-a-dope won't work here.Having said that Ali narrow UD, after edging the closeing stages.


60's version Ali takes a wider decision, through speed, movement and flurries.

 

And Ali never fought anyone like or as good as Lewis. Ali could not defeat Lewis the way he beat Foreman al la rope a dope, or Shavers via acting. And there is no way Lewis quits or tanks it like Liston did. If you ask me, Lewis power is comparable to Foreman's, Shavers or Liston.

Lewis in his prime was pretty quick too.

 

I love that gif. :good

 

:good :good :good :good

I`ll side with this guy.

Ali of 1966/67 was the best HWT Ive seen but big Lennox would be a test for anyone so that sounds about right.


Botswana :smoke

 

Ive always felt this was the case, he was phenomenal that night.

Ps. The Ali/Williams fight was on nov 14th 1966.

:good

 

Zora Folley landed more than a few punches, so I suppose Folley is better than most top 30 heavyweights in your list?

Lewis would cause Ali all kinds of trouble with his height, jab, sneaky left-hook, physical strength, skill and cautious style. However, Ali's STAMINA (not his speed) would triumph, as he'd be the more consistent of the two over 15 rounds and be able to put up the long combinations when they counted.

Over the championship distance I think Ali would win a close but firm decision (9-6 or 8-6-1 etc.) which wouldn't reflect how hard a night he had. This would be the kind of fight where Ali would be shown to be so much more than just a "fast slickster".

 

You just proved my point. The best fighter Lewis ever fought was a past his prime Holyfield, the first fight I fought he lost. Is a past it Holyfield really comparable to prime Ali? Of course not. Fact is, with all of the praise Lewis gets, and its warranted, he still didn't fight anybody near as good as Ali.

The point remains. Ali isn't getting knocked out because he was hit by bigger punches (in my opinion), but the overall point is he had withstood Lewis-like power before.

Not really. I think post-exile has a shot at beating Lennox as well. He was more filled out, still faster than Lewis, and his chin held up till the very end. Lewis would be favourite, but Ali could still outbox Lewis over 12.

 

I'd agree with the trend of the thread. Lennox brings a serious set of assets but unfortunately for him, he has not one of those assets that have proven problematic for Ali. He's large and strong and hits hard but that is not enough. Not nearly. He is fairly stationary, he's not exactly a versatile fighter, and his jab is not disruptive enough to cause problems either.

Lewis could attempt to blitz 1967 Ali as he did Golota and Ruddock, but his chances of victory would be far exceeded by the probability that he would not catch Ali and would be winded after about 4 rounds. If Lewis chooses to box Ali, he would look slow heaving those log arms, uncomfortable, and at times plodding and amateurish in comparison. Lewis thought about what he was doing during these types of performances and deliberate, stand-up styles like that were what made Ali's more dynamic and fluid style shine.

To beat Ali, you have to have the style and the structure to get in close and exploit his technical deficiencies. Lewis had neither. Believe it or not, he may be too big to deal with the still large, but more functional size of Ali. Speed can be offset by a tactical jab (Futch-Norton) and a superior outside game on wheels is nullified by getting in close, pressuring the boxer, and ripping up the body to take away the legs (Frazier).

Ali UD.

 

You said 'remotely as good as Ali'. What's your definition of remotely good? You don't think that Evander Holyfield, in many people's top 10 heavyweights of all time, was remotely as good as Ali? A little ridiculous I would contend. Lewis did not fight anyone as good as pre-exile Ali, but then neither did Holmes, Foreman, Frazier, Norton or Tyson for that matter.

No, Ali isn't get knocked out because he's Ali. I think we can both agree that he will definately not lose inside the distance.

Absolutely he has a shot, but any fight between him and Lewis would be much closer. Put it this way, if Ken Norton can beat post-exile Ali then I feel that Lewis has a better than even chance of doing the same, over the distance.

 

How would you call Lewis "not versatile" ?

He beat every man and style he ever faced, something Ali can't say. In fact, i'd say Lewis is more versatile than Ali and never had his Norton's or Frazier-style problems.

 

Yes, thats one of the ways. Frazier showed the way which could well have beaten a prime Ali when they fought in 1971. But it's not my first choice. Norton's style wasn't all about getting close and banging the body. His gameplan under Futch was to pary Ali's jab and come right back with his own, then force his way inside. Timing at long range was the key for Norton on the outside before he got inside and had success there. Norton faced an out of shape Ali who was slowly on the down curve, so I'm simply using it as a guage here.

Frazier's style is ideal to cause a prime Ali trouble, but only inside. I don't think Frazier has enough at long range to give Ali trouble up until he gets inside. Not offensively anyway. Perhaps leading with left hooks, not much else though. Certainly not straight shots down the middle. He does have the 'bob and weave' style to get underneath Ali's jab and make him miss. But nothing offensively at arms length to continually hit the mark.

I think Holmes' style would give Ali more trouble. Why? Because he's got the free-flowing jab and fluidity to box with Ali. He's also a better mover around the ring than Frazier; Multi dimensional. I can see Holmes taking more jabs than Frazier as he's more upright and taller. But offensively at long range Holmes has a solid jab and a straight right hand that Frazier simply can't bring to the table. And while Holmes wasn't as good as Frazier inside, he's better than Ali at close quarters IMO. Bodyshots and his uppercut.

IMO Holmes' best chance of beating a prime Ali would not be to stand at arms length, be tame, and try to beat Ali at his own game. But to be the aggressor behind his jab and try to exploit Ali's weaknesses that way. Be the hunter while working behind his jab. I think Holmes certainly has the mental capacity to get the best out of himself against a prime Ali.

 

Ali is not a sure bet vs Lewis.......Lewis could do it

 

Lummox Lewis wouldn't make Ali fight and Ali would waste our time and betting money, clowning his way to another "split" decision "victory". Lewis has always been a hoax on the public. Also, how the heck did Ali ever get decision wins in Norton II/III, Ali-Shavers? Larry finally showed everyone that all he really could do was lean on the ropes and shoot his mouth off. Leon Spinx shut his mouth too. Ali capitalized on the feeble heavyweight minds of his time. The public needed to be warned that Ali's fights were not intended to be taken seriously. You know, Elvis and Joe Louis had no problem entering the military--------DID THEY???????????

 

Lewis had something that was arguably better than versatility: he was 6'5 and a rock solid 245 pounds. He could generate great power in those shots, had a good jab, and was composed in there. Was he a top technician? No, he wasn't. He didn't have to be. Was he versatile? No, he wasn't. He didn't have to be.

Lewis not only "beat every man and every style he ever faced", he was a dominant heavyweight. And this was primarily because he had dominating size and related assets like strength and power. It was not because he was "versatile".

It's unfair to make the comparison between a 38/39 year old Ali and Lewis. Holmes and Berbick faced a fighter who was not only shot, but who had undeniable medical problems. I for one am more sure Holmes would beat Lewis than I am that he'd beat Ali in their respective primes. Berbick would be no more or less likely than McCall or Rahman to stop Lewis.

I think that you are confusing "versatility" with physical dominance.

 

Co-sign.