Muhammad Ali vs. Roy 'Tiger' Williams

These were obviously exhibition bouts, and frankly I don't give much merit to those. A prime Ali squared off in similar fashion with a middle aged Marciano, and some say the Rock looked pretty good against him, so that basically says all. Tiger Williams vs a serious Ali in a real sanctioned bout would be a mismatch, especially if it took place inbetween the rumble in the jungle and the thrilla in manilla.. Ali was hot, focussed and serious about proving himself to be the best. As for Tiger trash talking, he was just trying to make a name for himself by slandering an established super star. It certainly wasn't something that hadn't been done before by a nobody.

 

Agenda-driven thread. You cant help yourself. Every opportunity

 

Wasn't there some grudge between the two over money ?
Larry Holmes covers it in his book.
Something like Williams' undercard bout was cancelled because of something he blamed Ali and demanded the money. Ali didn't want to pay, so Williams threaten to kick his ass.
It was dead serious, not some game. Williams wanted his money, Ali didn't wanna pay, so in effect it was winner-takes-all.
Williams gave as good as he got, eventually Ali paid him, and never used him again as a sparring partner (?).

Something like that.
It wasn't a mismatch.

 

I have never seen much footage of tiger apart from the shavers fight. Holmes raved about williams in his book saying with out the chip on his shoulder tiger was good enough to be a world champ, he just did not trust anyone and never helped himself. Thats coming from holmes, a mistrusting chip on both shoulders kinda guy if ever there was one!

whatever the truth williams career did not pan out. For all his talent he lost to richard dunn. "my dinner with conteh" told me richard dunn beat tiger fair and square, boxed him at range and did enough to win.

 

The pieces are fallling into place, the puzzle is coming together, at last Ali is being exposed as the ***** ***oot he really is.

So did Ali ever face Williams in a pro fight where his precious legacy would be on the line? :-( No, he faced Ron Lyle and Joe Frazier instead. Disgraceful.

 

Well he did manage to face my main man Chuck Wepner, so let's not be too hard on him.. Wepner was the man who schooled a green Foreman, retired Sonny Liston, thrashed Earnie Terrell, and left Ali lying on ***** street, so taking on such a challenge was more than enough to seal his legacy. :smoke

 

I agree:good. He should be castrated for his flagrant ducking

 

I can't believe this isn't brought up more often as one of the great robberies in the history of the sport. Goes to show you how much the judges can read into a little blood..Wepner put on a clinic that night, battering Liston into retirement. Sad night to be a boxing fan.

He did land a brutal right hand to Ali's heart, and dropped him.

He sure did. Wepner learned the "heart punch" when he trained with Bruce Lee. Wepner was a prototype for the modern mixed martial artist.

 

My understanding was always that Ali used to torture Williams in sparring. Anyone who saw Williams go life and death with the very limited Ernie Shavers will understand that Ali was miles ahead of him.

 

Larry Holmes said it happened and anyway it's an interesting story and a good illustration of boxing business behind close doors, and the inequalities of pay.
Williams may well have been a "gym fighter".

Not sure why people are treating the story to ridicule. It's an interesting tale, if nothing else.

Funny, if it was the story of how young Cassius Clay schooled Johansson in 1961, or as a 16 year-old amateur boxed rings around Willie Pastrano, those same old familiar stories, no one doubts.

I don't see what's so difficult in giving Roy Williams his due, he just might have giving Ali hell that time, motivated by the issue of monies he felt he'd been cheated out of.

 

Thats because Ali actually accomplished something with his career and Roy proved to be a perrenial underachiever and thats if you believe he was as talented as a few say.

As for him being motivated by money, well, its prizefighting isnt it? What is going to pay more, a job as a sparring partner or fighting your way to a title shot? Had he been so motivated by the relative pittance of a sparring partner to give arguably greatest HW of all time hell then why wouldnt the substantially greater rewards of actual fights have proven a motivating factor to him.

With guys like these who supposedly have all the tools but never seem to pan out, well, the proof is in the pudding.

 

The whole point behind Holmes story was what a waste of talent Williams was .. Larry was there , saw it play out and told it straight up. His point was that an enraged Roy Williams fought two ten round brawls with a pre-Manila Ali at Deer Lake with pride on the line from both sides and fought him to a stand still. Holmes said it was very impressive, that Roy fought him tooth and nail on even terms and did not give an inch. It was not a matter of catching Ali on an off day for a flash knockdown. Ali came back the second day ready for war ...