Muhammad Ali was beating...

The rope-a-dope being invented in the Rumble in the Jungle is another myth. Ali used the rope-a-dope against Frazier in 1971, but Frazier didn't become a dope like Foreman did.

 

George Foreman gets no respect around here.

 

agree with all that it's myth-creating.

another thing with that documentary is that it tries to portray george foreman as this big fearless monster and ali was this knight who overcomes his fear. (like that crap from norman mailer that he saw fear in ali's eyes between rds 1 and 2.

ali was completely relaxed and welcomed in africa. foreman, on the other hand, was spooked and paranoid, his "brothers" completely against him, and wasn't training right.

 

The way Dundee tells it that the ropes had stretched in the humid heat and he actually tightened them and cut off the slack. After round 1 he noticed that the ropes had started to stretch a bit again and he wanted to tighten the once more, but Ali told him not to.

 

Ali went against the ropes fresh v foreman and as a plan of beating him. In FOTC Ali won the first rounds easy by moving and hitting even tho his timing was off and he was missing a few. later in the fight when he was tiring badly then he had to go to the ropes. different circumstances - tiredness and off-timing can be put to the long lay-off - look at ali v bonavena - i'll always remember Cossell commentary on that fight - he couldn't believe Ali was staying on the ropes, not moving & how bad he looked - something he never did in the 60s before exile. After that fight many thought Frazier could now beat him as it wasn't the same Ali only his great 15th round KO seem to hide that fact to many now.

 

He actually went to the ropes for a while early in the first fight against Chuvalo. Of course, Chuvalo could sustain that whaling all night long, so he soon got up on his bicycle again.

 

you know that movie is heavily edited to make ali look like a god dont you?
watch the fight yourself.
foreman gave ali hell against the ropes and landed some absolutely wicked body shots..
At one point he even knocks ali out on his feet for a brief moment. even ali has admitted he was seeing stars.
ali won most of the rounds but they were very close rounds up until the finish.

 

It wasn't a bad fight through the first five rounds, though I though Ali lead all the way.

 

Yeah, he stayed on the ropes & toyed with Frazier in some rds & in other rds Joe simply drove him into the ropes.... the actual tactic he used against Foreman was different to what he tried with Joe.

Ps. I dont think the actual rope-a-dope would have worked on Frazier the same as it did on Foreman anyway, different styles.

 

Good post. And you're quite right, Ali waved Frazier to come on while laying on the ropes in Manila and got a pretty severe beating from it.

 

I had it 5-2 (Ali) going into the 8th.

 

Many have posted good reasons to why. Truth is it's been aggrandized like many things but most knowledgeable boxing fans know the truth. It's the same in a sense with the Ali v Cooper fight. Ali gets floored and is in huge trouble so Dundee cuts his gloves and he gets almost a minute of extra time. In reality, nothing Dundee does seems suspect and Ali gets 5 to 10 extra seconds at the very most. Besides, Ali was fine going into the round and had incredible recuperative powers. It's one of those myths, but like most myths it grew and became the better story (George killing Ali for 8 rounds to Ali miraculously winning). After the fight Ali said, "I was winning wasn't I" to which everyone pretty much agrees. Close fight, but Ali was definitely winning. Don't confuse that to Ali not being courageous the way he was because he took some immense body shots, but he also made George miss a lot too.