MW from the divisions history with the best equipment to take out Greb?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by McGrain, Oct 30, 2007.


  1. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Which fighter from the history of the sport had the best chance to take out peak Greb over 15 rounds?

    The fighter you pick should weigh around 160.
     
  2. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Lets first look at the tools they will need.

    The guys who did best against Greb were those who went after him with a sustained body attack and di not give him room to set up his whirlwind attack. Tommy Loughran nwrote the blueprint.

    Anybody who tried to outbox him from range was toast.

    If you have to choose between Carlos Monzon and Marvin Hagler then you definitely want Hagler.
     
  3. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Not bad choices. Like with Tiger Flowers Greb would not have the power to take advantage of RJJs most critical weakness eg his chin.
     
  4. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Tiger Flowers had no problem outboxing Greb from long range, without getting toasted. Let's not make Greb some invincible monster. Plenty of middleweights in history have a chance to beat him.
     
  5. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I just don't see Jones beating my impression of Greb, bud. How many times can Jones counter these flurries, how many rounds can he cede whilst waiting for the edge to come of Greb's attack?

    Also, although Janitor and yourself are both quite right about Greb failing to take advantage of Jones' chin, isn't the value of Jones cracking power devalued by Grebs great chin?

    Anyway, i'll look forward to seeing your expanded opinion on a Jones win.


    EDIT: I meant beat, not stop. I think you're looking to HW before you find the guy who will stop him.
     
  6. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Jones had a better defense than any of multiple fighters who made Greb miss most of his punches, and he was a FAR better counter-puncher than anyone Greb faced in his career.
     
  7. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I agree that Flowers got the faded Greb. I agree that Greb is sometimes overated. I also agree with you that many, many HW's would have a chance against him.

    But who do you think is the very very best equipped to do him Senya?
     
  8. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Sure sure, and Greb is far better than anyone Jones faced full stop.

    But is Jones your pick? Or you think it's a reasonable pick?
     
  9. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Greb was not better than James Toney or Bernard Hopkins skillwise, very far from it. He wasn't tougher, he didn't hit harder. In all, as a boxer Greb was inferior to both.
     
  10. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I think that most would find beating Greb harder than beating Hopkins, although I don't see that much between them. I also agree with you about Toney, but I think the version of Toney that Jones beat just doesn't belong in the type of company we're talking about.

    Still, make a pick?
     
  11. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Beating Greb would not be harder for Jones than beating Hopkins. Jones was eating pressure fighters for breakfast in all of his fights except Glen Johnson, having far more trouble with counter-punchers, as is the case with most counter-type boxers-punchers.
     
  12. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Given that Jones absolutley outclassed Hopkins and scored a nearshut out, are you predicting a Jones KO? Or a clean sweep on the cards?
     
  13. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    I disagree.

    While his style was verry diferent he was just as skilled in his own way and in terms of natural talent he vastly surpases both. Perhaps even surpases Jones.
     
  14. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    The closest analogy to Jones among Greb's opponents would probably be Tommy Loughran. Young inexperienced Loughran arguably beat Greb the first time (I have a semi-local round by round report that gives Loughran 4 rounds, Greb 2, with 2 even) or, if he lost, only by very narrow margin (Philadelphia Inquirer sports editor) due to the difference in experience, and he was coming up strong, fighting the last round better than the first, having figured Greb's style by that point. He showed excellent defense and gave Greb a lot of troubles in the other bouts too, deserving the win in several of them, still before he reached his peak. Yet Loughran wasn't as good a counter-puncher and didn't have Jones' punching power and accuracy.
     
  15. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Yes but Greb did better as the series progresed and they both gained in experience.

    Also I am not too sure about the Loughran Jones analogy.