My All Time Top 5 HWTs (Ive no doubt)

Sorry, but George Foreman is not a greater heavyweight than Lennox Lewis.

 

1 Louis
2 Ali
3 Johnson
4 Marciano
5 I suppose Dempsey on legends?

 

Joe Louis
Muhammed Ali
Jack Johnson
Rocky Marciano
Larry Holmes

 

You forgot big Enzo :!:

 

my top 10 all time HW

1. Muhammad Ali
2. Joe Louis
3. Jack Dempsey
4. Jack Johnson
5. Ezzard Charles
6. Gene Tunney
7. Rocky Marciano
8. Lennox Lewis
9. Evander Holyfield
10. Larry Holmes

then, Foreman is not in My top 10...even Liston and frazier...
holyfield is not considered top 10 HW in many experts' lists but i would rank him at 9 ahead of holmes, foreman and frazier...

 

1 Louis
2 Ali
3 Holmes
4 Marciano
5 Foreman
6 Dempsey
7 Frazier
8 Lewis
9 Holyfield
10 Liston

Tyson #2...I can't even squezze him into a top 10...Top 15 (13 for me)

 

Thanks, that means a lot.

That has been my top 10 for several years now, but the order shifts now and then. Lewis has crept up a few spots in recent years, even though he has been inactive.

 

Louis
Marciano
Ali
Dempsey
Lewis

 

Good list.

The top 3 is the same as mine. Holmes at 4 is good too, I usually have him around there. The only thing I can say is Foreman is a little too high, I have him near the bottom of the top ten but good list.

 

1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. Rocky Marciano
4. Larry Holmes
5..............Jack Johnson

I have been switching #5 a lot, I'm trying to decide if I should put Lennox Lewis there instead.

 

how about charles, tunney and more..

holyfield is top 10 HW if you would consider only his career at HW..

 

Whats wrong with me? He's supposed to big second.atsch

 

Ali/Louis (indistinguishable to me)
Marciano
Lewis
Holmes

Very clear-cut for me - Ali and Louis are the lock #1/#2, Marciano #3...etc

6-10 would look something like this -
Foreman/Tyson
Frazier/Liston
Holyfield

pre-Dempsey fighters excluded. Johnson would probably sneak into the 5-10 range.

Names for a top 11-20 (no order) -

Walcott
Charles
Patterson
Schmeling
Johansson
Norton
Wladimir Klitschko
Dempsey
Moore
Tunney

I am very uncomfortable the the Tunney and Moore picks. I'm sure I can find someone to replace them eventually.

 

I am very confident with my top 10 choices, if not entirely so with their order. The only name "missing" is Johnson, who I do not rate because it opens up a whole new can of worms, but he certainly deserves a top 10 placing. I would put Holyfield at #11 and give Johnson a top 10 spot if I were to include him.

Louis and Ali are a clear cut above anyone else.

Marciano - ditto. he'd be up on the Louis/Ali tier if he had fought more contenders, but going undefeated + KO'ing all of them (plus pretty much everyone) and beating no small number of ranked contenders himself has him as my CLEAR #3.

Lewis beat many ranked (and good ones, at that) contenders himself. What holds him back from being higher is that he was iced twice by ~mediocre fighters. He is only behind true greatness in Louis and Ali and perfection in Marciano. Not a low ranking by any means.

Holmes is like Lewis but he fought worse competition and cherrypicked to a greater extent later on. An impressive record, though, and his 90s resume is just gravy.

Foreman gets in because of his resume in the 1970s (bar the Greatest himself and his poor performance against Young). His 1990s resume is greater than Holmes' but he has a lot more ground to make up because of his 1970s losses. I rate his comeback very highly, though.

I rate Tyson very highly because I think that the best version of Tyson that we saw never lost. In the same way that Ali was diminished by the time he lost to Frazier, I think Tyson had deteriorated in both physical condition and technique as early as Bruno I and certainly so by Douglas. His 1990s/2000s resume gives enough "beef" to make me confident that his 1980s self was good enough for a #5/#6 ranking.

Frazier had an impressive run to the title and the win over Ali. He was demolished by Foreman, which I am partly willing to excuse because of a terrible styles matchup + questionable refereeing + poor physical condition, but the fact is that he did not face that many ranked contenders (compared to Ali, Louis, Lewis, etc.) and did not beat + dominate all of them (like Marciano did). He did alot in a short career, but to break the top 5 you have to do even more in a LONG career and not get dominated like he was.


Liston is comparable to Frazier in that he was a true destroyer when coming up through the ranks. Liston's 1958-1962 run is very impressive and his losses to Marshall and Martin are not held in high regard because of their placements in his career (he also avenged Marshall). Ali I, even though I consider it a bit post-prime (think Tyson-Bruno I), is damaging to his ranking, but I am convinced enough that Ali II was a dive that I do not doubly/triply penalize him for quitting/being stopped/losing to the same guy twice. Liston beat a good deal of ranked contenders via domination and only lost to the Greatest himself during his prime/near-prime. He also had an overlooked run post-Ali that is worth some consideration.

I do not rank Holyfield as highly as many. I don't think he was ever the real best man in the HW division at any time. I rate him rather highly in a p4p sense because he was a truly great CW that moved up and mad serious noise at HW while mostly past his best, but being past your best does not justify a record that is, quite accurately, hit-or-miss. He was thoroughly beaten by Bowe in their trilogy and 1-1 with Moorer during his early years at HW. His wins over Foreman and especially Holmes are not overtly impressive. All in all, he beat some good (and average) contenders like Mercer, Dokes, Stewart, et al. He was well past his best by the time of the Lewis fights but did not impress me very much there either. His best wins are undoubtedly the two over Tyson, but I do not think they do enough to overshadow going 1-2 against Bowe (who, despite his talent, never really did that much else in an ATG sense) and losing to Moorer.

EDIT - completely forgot about Wills! 8-12ish for him, most likely.