my current p4p list top... 10 or so

As I said, p4p to me is who I think beats who regardless of weight right now. Purely on ability. Record to me only means as much as it shows ability. So I do rate fighters highly whose wins are more dominant against top opposition, and who've faced a variety of styles. My top guys have been dominant and have hardly shown vulnerability.

For Rigondeaux and Lomachenko the amateurs they were definitely contributes to how highly I rate them p4p. I think I probably should have included a couple current Cuban amateurs. Lomachenko's loss was to a really good and much bigger fighter in Salido, and it was a fight I thought he won, despite poor officiating. Further, he's fine-tuned himself as a pro since then.

At least I'm consistent based on my criteria. If proven success is so important for you, why do you have Rigo who you question as high as 7? And young, unproven Crawford at 8?

 

True enough that you can't scale a boxer up or down without changing the fighter he is. But wasn't inventing the term p4p for Robinson basically an attempt to do that? It was coined at least to acknowledge smaller fighters who don't get as much appreciation.

And I think trying to make p4p more 'objective' comparison of achievements is just as fraught and impossible. Because in boxing everyone handpicks their opponents to a degree, they aren't forced to fight the best in their division. So records and accomplishments are often a mirage. That's why we've had the constant, unproveable debatesabout how good Pacquiao is (or Floyd). It's why even divisional rankings can't be measured.

The adjective 'mythical' used to almost always precede the term pound for pound. Because it was acknowleged that it was a hypothetical exercise to debate who would beat who if they were the same weight. I think that's only been forgotten the last 20 years or so because being a p4p great has become more prestigious, while divisional dominance has lost its authority. So people want a fighter to show he's p4p. And in turn achievement becomes what p4p's understood as. Achievement is how 'all time greatness' is measured. But p4p I think should be left to more hypothetical debate.

 

All fair points.