My Take on Marciano

Marciano made my top ten until the arrival of Holyfield,Lewis, and Tyson,now he is just outside it,one in front of Frazier .

 

I have them all around the middle to end of that list - hard to judge Lewis and Tyson and Evander because both did not really fight prime Tyson but Tyson still dangerous. For me that new group pushed Johnson -Jeffries and Holmes back some bordering the lower end of ten or the beginning of 10-15 - my top 5 has changed but still the same 5 guys

 

Very reasonable.I have Johnson probably too high and although, as you pointed out, Holmes missed some of the young studs ,I have him about 5 or 6.Jeffries made my ten until about 25 years ago.

 

I reevaluate every few years usually a few slight changes - fighters like Foreman are hard to figure because he had 2 careers and he made his mark in both but while the older guy showed improvement in managing his stamina issues and controlling his pace, the younger version had tremendous power but flaws that the older version made some style changes to improve with less of a young body - he still fits in strongly in the middle somewhere.

I am interested in this current decade to see where the chips fall and see if anyone fits in somewhere - only time will tell

 

I love it when people say ridiculous **** like this, gives my eyebrows a good workout.

No offense meant, just dumb to talk about street fights in the same breath as athleticism,
or to believe someones record when it comes to scraps outside of Queensbury rules lol.

 

I will think about how someone can come to this conclusion until the day I die.

 

I was a street guy when young I was born in the same neighborhood as Tyson, Bowe, Mark Breland and many other great NY fighters. Some of the greatest fighters started in the streets - Ray robinson, Jake LaMotta, Ruben " Hurricane "Carter Sonny Liston, Graziano, Al"Bummy Davis, among many others. The Queensbury rules were meant to contain order in the ring with rules but the spirit of fighting starts somewhere. The battle of strength - will- and killer instinct start somewhere - the Queensbury rules kept the beast in man somewhat contained but it is the contained beast in man that is the nucleus or essence or main element when things get down to the nitty gritty - boxing is brutal and so are the streets - a bridle can direct a stallion but the strength and will of the stallion will determine the drive to victory - tough neighborhoods and street fights mold a man and prepare him for battle - many a troubled young man became a great Champion with the right guidance but it does not start with Queensbury rules

 

Best of his era, he could’ve been the best of Floyd’s era for a time too but lacked the fire to continue he retired undefeated with great fighters on his resume in respectable condition.

Walcott was still strong and game his best win Ezz was past his best but still a challenge almost too much of a challenge I couldn’t see other champions struggling with Ezz the way the Rock did but his crude style gave Charles the advatange to me.

What raises eyebrows to me is how much he struggled with Joe Louis at such an advance age either it is a testimony to the greatness of the brown bomber or flaws of Rocky.

A good but not great fighter the embodiment of determination overtaking talent, the best man of his era he did what a champion was supposed to and defended his title and beat who was put before him he didn’t retire prematurely he didn’t fight on too long he did enough to deserve his spot in history as one of the best to lace up gloves.

What Rocky did was inspire he was not tall he was not graceful or handsome, charismatic, broad of shoulder anything special to look at without a shirt he was someone who stood shoulder to shoulder with the small people of the world a testimony to hard work getting you where you want.

 

Truth in this aside from the man beast talk hard places breed hard man.

 

I grew up in a hard area pal.
We ain't ever had a world champion boxer.
Street fights have nothing to do with athleticism, and if we believe people's street fight records Charlie Z really is the GOAT.

I've rarely seen a fair fight on the street.


Still though, no disrespect meant.
I'm sure you've got some crazy stories.

 

Wait Charlie Z isn’t the GOAT?

 

All I know is that the best Marciano could possibly defeat ANY 200 pound and under fighter who ever laced up gloves. And he'd beat some over 200 pounders. I wouldn't be surprised to see him beat Floyd Patterson, 187-190 pound Evander Holyfield, Michael Spinks, Michael Moorer, Oleksander Usyk etc.

 

Could he beat Valuev?

 

A great little attrition heavyweight who fought a very narrow variety of elite fighters during his brief stay at the top. His best attributes- stamina, durability, strength- were flattered by those of his best challengers, old, shopworn, undersized.

Sub 200 pounders? He's in serious contention as the head to head best. Over 200 head to head and his potential declines precipitously.

Take him as he was, a great warrior who matched his times.