my top 10 lightweights of all time

Im not on the point of Oscar being the best at whatever of the 90's, i think if we gwt into that it will get very long-winded because he is one of your faves. You havent replied to the rest of my post i see.

One thing i hate in boxing, is when people say a guy lost a fight because of something he did or didnt do, rather than actually giving the guy who won the fight the credit for doing so. We'll never know for sure, but imo, Mayweather made the adjustments that a thinking fighter would, and won it.

 

Thereabouts, he was by no means an elite boxer until he did so well against Floyd. Was not a top 10 P4P fighter at any point I don't believe. He was like a watered down Chavez, about two levels lower.

And how good a past prime Pea was that he was able to arguably beat a prime Oscar. What does that say about a prime Pea?

I am no more biased(even less as a matter of fact, considering far more would agree with my thoughts on Pea) on Pea than you are on someone like Liston, or most of your favorites. You're more biased toward DLH than I am Whitaker, given your ridiculously high rating of him which hardly anyone agrees with while most agree that Whitaker should be rated much higher.

Nice saying.

:good

 

Most of the guys that should be on the list are. h2h Mosley stays with any of them, but I honestly don't think his opposition was good enough to warrant a top 10 ranking. Anywhere from 13-20 is reasonable, imo.

 

Yeah, I guess Ramirez(a Castillo level fighter), Nelson, Chavez, Oscar, etc. were scrubs.

He was the best LW in his time. So that disproves your un-witty remark quite easily.

Floyd always has brittle hands, he had no trouble throwing punches in the bout, unlike when he broke his hand against Hernandez.

Well, he rates top 4 for both of us when all factors are taken into consideration, despite the fact that his resume is outshined by quite a few others. That must mean in a purely head to head sense, he rates even higher, now doesn't it? Whether you rate him #3 or I rate him #1 H2H, I don't see a big difference. I think he handily beats Williams(as does Williams's biggest fan on this site) and beats Duran as well based on styles, and have argued it to no end many times.

You're taking my head to head list with your overall list, which is unfair, and you know this. Oscar was nowhere near as good or consistent at WW as Pea was at LW, even though he did face better comp. Either way, Pea proved himself capable of doing the same when he moved up in weight. He rates similarly at WW for me as Oscar does.

So why is he top 4 for you at LW then?

What a foolish statement anyways, as his best win was obviously the #1 P4P Chavez, who Pea schooled. If you're counting Oscar's wins over Tito and Mosley, I'll count this for Pea, as everyone with a brain does. His win at JMW over Vasquez was also a fantastic and underrated win, as well as his wins over McGirt, who was a top 5 P4P fighter at the time.

You think wrong.

[url]http://www.eastsideboxing.com/forum/showthread.php?t=66478&highlight=whitaker+hoya[/url]

 

Oscar's comp at 135lbs essentially consisted of Molina, Leija, Ruelas, and Hernandez. Mosley has two of those names on his lightweight resume (and he handled Molina far more conclusively than DLH).

Ruelas wasn't really all that special...and while the Hernandez victory was better than any of Mosley's big wins, Mosley makes up the ground in terms of quantity.

 

He likely beat better competition(though not great either) but he was definitely NOT more dominant.

 

Pernell's claim to fame is that he outpointed chavez by 5 points and edged a p4p fighter like mcgirt by 1 or 2 points. I would expect every great/very good lightweight to beat Azumah Nelson, so that win isnt off the charts in my opinion. I would expect most fellow atg to beat Julio Vasquez too. Saying that he is unbeatable head to head at lightweight, when his 3 best wins actually came at a higher weight, is just ****ed up.

 

Give Shane Mosley the same competiton that pernell fought at lightweight and he goes 12-0 against that group too, so would Oscar De la Hoya.

 

You think he'd beat Duran and Leonard, so why is it ****ed up to think he would beat other lesser fighters?

And no, most top LW's would most certainly NOT have beaten Vasquez at 154. Hell, anyone that tried to bang with him or stand in range with that type of size disadvantage would've gotten their asses beat.