My top 20 heavyweights of all time

Hamed didnt avoid anyone, he was the clear number 1# fw in the world and had been for some time, the only 2 left to take care of were Morales and Barerra, had he beat one of them, imo his legacy would have been secure.

There is a video on youtube somewhere which shows how many people were ducking Hamed and not the other way round.

Hamed fought in an era of 2 other great fighters, Wlad doesnt, that takes nothing away from Wlad though.

 

Louis was born 1914. Those born around that time had access to films, first hand testimonials, and the fighters and managers that have long since passed.

I am more than sure guys who voted saw and hear stuff that you and I have not.

 

Walcott #9 is unique. Few have Charles in their top 13. I guess everyone sees it differently.

 

Johnson
Jeffries
Ali
Foreman
Dempsey
Louis
Bowe
Marciano
Holmes
Tyson
Lewis
Frazier
Tunney
Holyfield
Charles
Liston
Fitzsimmons
Schmeling
Patterson
Corbett

In versatility, Louis, Lewis, & Holyfield rank near the top but Holy's poor showing dropped him near the bottom while Lewis' chin hurt him severely, dropping him well below people like Foreman & Dempsey

Ali beat Foreman which vaults him high on the list. However he does not rank first becuz of the Norton fight

I wanted to rank Bowe at the top becuz of his size and endless stamina, I think he would take almost every one on the list but his short record of defenses dropped him somewhat

Johnson fared the best based on top overall ability not to mention he was a real go getter

Walcott & Langford were replaced by more worthy fighters Corbett & Fitzsimmons

 

Wlad had rematch clause but not an immediate rematch clause. Sanders had the right to make at least one title defense. There was a long delay as Sanders explored a super fight with Roy Jones Jr.

[url]http://www.secondsout.com/world-boxing-news/world-boxing-news/klitschkos-rematch-clause[/url]

By Anthony Evans: Corrie Sanders will be allowed one voluntary defence of the WBO heavyweight title he so easily wrenched from Wladimir Klitschko’s grasp before he is contractually obligated to fight the 1996 Olympic champion once again.


The WBO than said Sanders had to defend against their best available contender, Lamon Brewster or he would be stripped.

[url]http://www.secondsout.com/usa-boxing-news/usa-boxing-news/wont-wait-for-tuaman[/url]


According to the WBO Regulations of World Championship Contests, newly crowned Heavyweight Champion Corrie Sanders must defend his title against the best available contender no later than 120 days from the date he won the Championship. Therefore, the bout must take place no later than July 4, 2003. This is due to the fact that Sanders was not the mandatory challenger when he dethroned then Champion Wladimir Klitschko on March 8, 2003 in Hamburg Germany


Sanders was still willing to fight Jones, but Jones wouldn't agree to the fight. Faced with Brewster as his mandatory, Sanders just dumped the belt and went after Vitali for Lewis' more prestigious WBC belt.

[url]http://www.secondsout.com/usa-boxing-news/usa-boxing-news/berman-jones-jr-is-running-scared[/url]

Bernath: Though Rodney Berman, the promoter of South African WBO heavyweight champion Corrie Sanders has accepted that his fighter will have to defend against No.1 contender Lamont Brewster within 90 days, as per the World Boxing Organization’s decision, he still has not fully given up on Sanders sharing the ring with WBA heavyweight king Roy Jones Jr.
In an exclusive interview with SecondsOut.com Berman has accused the world’s pound for pound king Jones jr of running scared of the 37 year-old South African southpaw.

SecondsOut revealed last week that Sanders had signed a lucrative contract to fight WBA heavyweight king Roy Jones Jr in a unification fight in Las Vegas on November 8. And pound for pound king Jones Jr’s promoter Murad Muhammad confirmed as much but it now appears Jones himself had not signed the contract.

 

not at all, not at all

I see exactly why he ranked them in this order.

Bowe has a huge edge over Frazier with superior size and his work rate exceeded Joe's. In addition, Bowe had more tools

When I did my ranking, I took out Walcott and placed Fitzsimmons instead. Chrales you might make a case for but not Walcott

It's a very fine list, not unlike my own

 

"access to films"

Guesswork, actually. The greater sophistication of modern film-preservation and groups like the National Film Registry and the AFI possibly--I would say probably--means films are being much better preserved and protected than they were generations ago. That is why most pre-1930 films are lost.

I do remember Jim Jacobs staging a showing of his ancient pre-1920 fight films to the New York sporting press in the early sixties and the shocked reaction of the sportswriters. Most had obviously not seen these films at that point. I remember that Willard was re-evaluated when the Willard-Johnson fight surfaced in Australia.

"hear stuff"

Okay. We have gone from being at ringside to hearsay from old-timers who may or may not have seen much of these fighters.

Take Fleischer. I have read that the first heavyweight championship fight he actually saw was Johnson-Jeffries. If so, he never actually saw Corbett, Fitz, or Sullivan in a real fight, or Jeff anywhere near his prime. His viewings of the first three were in sparring matches in vaudeville when old men. Hard to see what that would prove.

*The above assumes that what is written about Fleischer is accurate. In fairness, who knows?

 

Bowe above Marciano ?

And Holmes?

And Tyson ?

And Lewis ?

And Frazier ?

 

Wlad never pressed for the fight.

They owned his ass just like Byrd when he was forced straight into a fight with Wlad after he took the WBO belt from Vitali. Byrd claimed he never had a choice.

If Wlaad wanted it he would of gotten it. What reason would Sanders have to duck out? He destroyed him easily in a single round. He was only after a pay check and he was in the position for a nice one by fighting Wlad again.
Wlad had no interest so Vitali stepped in.

The big shots Sanders cought Vitali with early meant it would of been the same result againt Wlad.

 

Wlad could not press for the fight. Only if Sanders beat Brewster and kept his WBO belt, could Wlad press for it.

You've been shown three articles that lay the entire story out crystal clear. It's a shame the fight didn't happen but nobody ducked anybody. Except for maybe Jones Jr. not wanting any part of Sanders.

They did not own his ass. Sanders had the option in his contract to pursue another fight, so he tried to make the most of it and ultimately did.

 

The fight was there to be made. Wlad didn't want it.

 

What about this statemennt leads you to this conclusion?

Corrie Sanders will be allowed one voluntary defence of the WBO heavyweight title he so easily wrenched from Wladimir Klitschko’s grasp before he is contractually obligated to fight the 1996 Olympic champion once again.

 

Show me where it says it couldn't be against Wladimir Klitschko?

Froch didn't have to rematch Groves. But he did.

Wlad did not go after the fight because he is a bum. He could of had the WBO call an instant rematch. Wlad and his managment have a very good repport with the WBO.