NBA, NYSAC and Jack Dempsey

Overall the short answer is the bodies evolved into what they are today.

Firstly, the bodies were not above the racism of that era and could be held accountable for more than just the fights that did not happen. Or, I should say the American bodies. The BBBoC and EBU are not yet subordinates and as far as I know never did draw a color line. The only issue there is no one recognizes a HW champion with an EBU belt alone. IBU bakc then for any reader who didn't know.

The Walker Law lays out the weight divisions not the mandatory schedule. The NYSAC formed to regulate, as in make sure dudes weighed what they claimed.

To be super clear, in 1920, there is no mandos.

By 1922 the NBA and NYSAC both oversee weight divisions and have a fancy new mechanism for legitimizing contenders; ratings

By 23 the american bodies have put themselves in a corner, their fancy new ratings made it too easy for a black man, Wills of course, to force his way into title contention.

Sidenote, Ring ratings start in 24. Body ratings in 22 and 23 are useful but hella hard to find. I think, Brooklyn Eagle if memory can be trusted.

I'll not be the one here to bring narrative to Dempsey-Wills negotiations. I haven't the patience for whatever camp I upset and it doesn't matter. Back then the talks were enough to satisfy the bodies because mandatories were a new idea and scheduled mandatories were not yet implemented.

Tunney gave racist boxing someone they can pressure Jack with and not **** off the public. Bodies included.

 

Dempsey had otherwise cleaned out the division and it took time for his credibility to erode. While Dempsey didn't fight for 3 years this situation was more like 2 years from when Dempsey pulled out of their fight in late 1924 and Wills beat Firpo. Before this rankings show Wills case had slowly cooled off in the 4 years as the Fulton win diminished in importance.

The sanctioning body system had just been established and there was no established procedure for dealing for a champion refusing to fight the clear number 2. Up to this points HW lineal champions being inactive had been the norm except for Burns and Johnsons 1909.

If we look at Wills from 1924 like an interim champ during Dempseys sabatical he fought twice against Weinart and Floyd Johnson. While Dempsey was under pressure to fight Wills it was just to fight Wills. If Wills didn't exist no one would have really cared about him not fighting for 3 years and he would not have been close to losing recognition. When Tunney came up to HW it was then Wills and Tunney. Other then them the division was seen as having been cleaned out. If Dempsey had beaten Wills and Tunney he probably could have gotten away with 5 years off like John L Sullivan.

 

The IBU and BBBCs subordination was established by their champions losing over and over if they had the best fighters they wouldn't have been subordinate titles. When Carpentier beat Levinsky at LHW the IBU became the lineal title. At HW the IBU was stuck with Ermino Spalla. The British titles had the most worth before WW1 when the BBBC didn't exist.

Ironically the IBU were the first ones to start stripping champs willy nilly with Schmeling, Carnera and Uzcudchin. They kept going back to Pierre Charles.

 

I have a very long thread on the history of bodies if you're interested in deep diving.

I'd say that plus reacting to the NBA becoming WBA.

Lineal being a post dated concept, I have no argument for that except to say I more often see Root cited as first, if not him then Choynski. Either way, George being first seems a bit late but I'd not fight it either.


That's far on the naming and stuff. I was trying to be quick, not hit that 10k cap because that is frustrating! I hate trying to figure out how to best cut one post into two or three. I'd refer to the thread if I was going to be very exact, but as far as I remember, the BBBoC was born out of the NSC like how the EBU is the IBU. Not exactly the same and not the same goals but successor of the former all the same.

So in eras prior to EBU I do mean IBU and prior to BBBoC I mean NSC. We've had enough interaction, I'm pretty sure you know what I'm saying but if not, no problem bro, I can go deeper.

Sometimes it's hard to write to two audiences and we always have two here. Knowledgeable fans, and newer fans still learning what has become basic to a lot of us. My bad, I just simply did a bad job at that.



In the 1920s boxing became a sport with mass appeal. Boxers could appear at large venues and earn more money than at the National Sporting Club. As a result, the club was forced to open its doors to the public in October 1928. However, in 1929, it was forced to close its premises in Covent Garden. A new organization, the British Boxing Board of Control, was formed to control the sport. Most of the board of the new organization were senior members of the NSC. The NSC was given a permanent seat on the new Board of Control and retained this privilege until 1937.



Lastly, I dod not say they wouldn't strip a champion for refusing a challenger, that happened even before the NBA or NYSAC formed. Johnson was stripped and reinstated by the IBU, I think, if I remember correctly.

 

The first champs and claimants were(mostly) not crowned by sanctrioning bodies. I have the first LHW title fight taking place in 1897.

IMO I usually refer to the BBBC champ as the Commonwealth champ which the BBBC champ usually holds(the Commonwealth title is run by a subsidary of the BBBC). The Commonwealth belt goes back to 1888 and is older than the NSC itself. I consider both the Commonwealth belt and former NSC belt the peer of IBU/EBU. While the BBBC wasn't a strictly regional organization by the time it was founded in 1929 it might as well have been. If a BBBC champ was worthy of that designation after that they probably have the Commonwealth belt anyway making the distinction moot. When the NSC existed the Commonwealth and NSC champs were usually not the same person in part mainly because the Australians were better at boxing then the British and Australians weren't travelling to the NSC.

So basically
Pre 1929 NSC, Commonwealth, IBU
Post 1929 Commonwealth, IBU

I do not think the IBU ever recognized Johnson because it crowned Langford right after it was formed. Before the creation of sanctioning bodys champions were(with some exceptions) acknowledged by the public accepting a fighter or promoters claim. The sanctioning bodys authority needed to be established over time. The first thing that got champs stripped was leaving the country or continent for an extended period of time because leaving say Europe meant you couldn't fight the IBUs top fighters etc.

 

Yank industrialists funded the Nazi war machine throughout the 20s & 30s, (And unbelievably during WW2) The Dulles Boys,The Bush family,Henry Ford etc so the time wasnt right for Harry Wills to be fighting for the Worlds Heavyweight title

In one of Pollacks Dempsey books the British Empire was mentioned as kind of shot callers as to who could fight for the title if im remembering it correctly

 

LOL? Where did Germany get the money from to build a empire when it was destitute

These blokes ran the Yoonited States

This content is protected

 

And Profited!!!

 

You are out of the loop.It was being built for 2 decades with massive support from Americans

 

And after WW2 Ford sued the US Government

Ford Motor Company did file a lawsuit against the U.S. government after World War Il related to the bombing of its German subsidiary, Ford-Werke, during the conflict. The lawsuit stemmed from damages sustained by Ford-Werke's facilities in Cologne, Germany, which were bombed by Allied forces, including the U.S. Army Air Forces, as part of the broader campaign against Nazi industrial targets. Ford sought compensation for the destruction of its property, arguing that it was entitled to reparations under U.S. law for losses incurred due to wartime
actions.

And WON

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/sep/25/usa.secondworldwar



Adolfs inspiration was Henry Ford

He "attributes all evil to Jews or to the Jewish capitalists," the friend wrote in his diary. "The Jews caused the war, the Jews caused the outbreak of thieving and robbery all over the country, the Jews caused the inefficiency of the navy…"

 

Next time you patriotic Americans buy Ford try and remember WW2 and the profits from death