No mas!-Explained!

This whole story is based on Bob Arum guesstimating that Duran weighed more than 190? When exactly did Arum visit him in Panama? Are there any contemporaneous reports of Duran being that fat from the summer in 1980, or of Arum attempting to postpone the fight for that matter? I could be wrong but these tales reek of excuses and exaggerations that emerged after the fact. I don't think I've seen a single source expressing serious concern about Duran's weight in the months prior to the fight.

 

Well, the actual words as stated in Christian Giudice's biography were 'No quiero peleo con el payaso' which means 'I don't want to fight this clown', which has less of a surrendering tone but does point to his frustration at chasing Leonard around the ring. It was an impulsive and impetuous decision that I'm sure he pretty much immediately regretted once he saw the shitstorm it caused and from there it was a damage limitation job and the whole stomach cramps (real or imagined) excuse came out.

 

Funny how you won't believe SRL own words that he KNEW Duran would be out of shape and wanted to fight made as soon as possible knowing it would put Duran at a disadvantage. You change that to, oh he was just saying that to try and act clever. Then when you have Arum, Arcel and various other people claiming that SRL's plan worked because of how out of shape Duran was... that also doesn't count and is an "exaggeration and excuses". When we have detailed reports and evidence that Duran simply had an issue in between fights and staying in shape. For Christ's sake, while still the LW champion, he had numerous fights above that weight BECAUSE HE COULDN'T MAKE THE WEIGHT, but they still wanted to keep him somewhat active. Then when they got him back down to the LW limit, he defends his title. There is story after story of Duran's legendary splurging in between fights, yet here it's, oh I think it was an exaggeration and he really wasn't that out of shape... It's weird. What's worse though, you whole reasoning on why he wasn't that out of shape because there was "TALK" of a fight happening. Do you know how much TALK there are about fights all the time that don't come about. Yet you think it's logical this talk would've got Duran in the gym to make things happen, when defending his LW crown for actual fights couldn't get him to make the weight, but talk, talk of a fight...yup he was in the gym right away. It's comical Big Kev.

 

I've never doubted that Duran put on weight after the first fight--he was an indisciplined little glutton. But the idea that he was up in the 190s a month or two out seems extremely farfetched. I would need more convincing evidence before I believed such a thing. 1980 Duran would have looked round and ridiculous at 170, and you guys want to believe that he was 190-200 because Bob Arum (allegedly) said so, I assume well after the fact??

Let me know if you have more details on the Arum story or on Arcel wanting to call off the fight. Or if you find any contemporary coverage validating any of this stuff or expressing concern about Duran's weight in the months between the two fights.

And I never take anything Leonard has to say about anything at face value, and he's also had inconsistent stories about what led to the rematch going down. The "I saw how fat Duran was and wanted to rush the fight" story came along well after the fact, as far as I can tell. And I'd have to double-check but I'm not even sure it's consistent with the timeline.

I get it. A lot of classic boxing fans really want to downplay Duran-Leonard II as much as possible, so they end up uncritically embracing even the most far-fetched, unsubstantiated stories. Not I.

 

Not sure I've ever seen a bigger set of inconsistent excuses and explanations than those that Duran and his people have offered with respect to this fight: https://www.boxingforum24.com/threads/duran-explains-why-he-quit-april-1981-ring-interview.594341/

 

who knows? Duran had more stories than Walt Disney .. But with mouthpiece in No sigo was misinterpreted as No mas according to him

 

OK, I'm an expert on the "No mas" fight. Just look at my user name here.

First off, Leonard said it. Leonard said "No mas," not Duran. When Leonard was slated to fight Marvin Hagler, Leonard actually held a press conference in a boxing ring and he invited Hagler to attend. Ray Leonard went on and on about a fight with Hagler -- "It will be the biggest fight ever. Greatest fight ever" -- and then Leonard said, "Unfortunately, it'll never happen." Leonard said "No mas" and retired. He's the quitter, not Duran. Now that's a fact.

Now as to Duran, what he did in the ring against Leonard in New Orleans was not "no mas." He never said it. What Duran did say with his words and actions was "F**k this!" He was tired of fighting a guy who was running and doing pitty-pat flurries and was clowning in the ring. Duran is a man. He wanted to fight a man. Leonard was not a man. He was a pitty-pat flurry girly clown. So Duran acted like a man and said "F**k this" and just ended the bullcrap that we were witnessing because Leonard was not there to fight.

What Duran did was the greatest thing any athlete ever did in sports (although the guy on the Buffalo Bills retiring at halftime yesterday was pretty cool. His team sucks, he ain't helping...enough of this sh!t.). Duran was a man. He said "F**k this" not "no mas." Huge difference.

 

People like this are why I hate Duran.

 

This is the longest layoff of Duran’s career. So he had more time to get ready for it than any other fight had he chosen to do so. Negotiations, according to Leonard’s accounts, began soon after the first fight ... he says he wanted Duran back in the ring as soon as possible ... and so Duran’s side was well aware almost immediately that they’d be fighting again.

If he chose to pig out, who’s that on? Leonard? You think if they had made the fight for the following March that Duran would have gone straight into training in the fall, or just partied longer?

Here’s how that would have worked. Duran’s team knew he was undisciplined. Their thing was to save him from himself. If he doesn’t fight Leonard right away, Duran still has to defend his title sometime ... so he ends up waddling into the ring after a similar weight loss against a no-name or maybe signs for bigger money (but not as big as a Leonard rematch) against Thomas Hearns or Benetiz ... and that wouldn’t do well anyway. He agreed to the money and the date. If he pulls out because his fat ass isn’t in shape then there’s no Leonard rematch and ... what?

 

Your right on the money here

 

I will qualify this post by first stating that Duran was my fave fighter along with Ali when I was a kid growing up in the 70s. His display in Montreal was one of the greatest displays of fighting I have seen but I believe that Roberto was surprised by both Leonard’s guts and at how good he actually was which contributed to Roberto’s lack of fire and competitiveness in the rematch.

Roberto had never earned the really big money before Montreal and I have no doubt he let himself get badly out of shape after the fight but the whole 190 pounds story is pretty unbelievable to me.

Nobody could argue that Duran in was anywhere near as good shape physically or mentally as he was in the first Leonard fight but that’s his own fault and cannot be used as an excuse. In reality Montreal was his peak n it was all down hill from there as far as his mind set and ability to make himself train properly and be disciplined.

Roberto never liked fighting tough, tall, stick n move types ( does anyone ? ) Edwin Viruet showed that, even Lou Bizarro managed to go 14 n a half rounds with Duran by sticking n moving at high speed.

The combination of Leonard’s natural improvement, Duran’s decline and Roberto’s pride and street fighter upbringing all contributed to Roberto quitting in that fight. Duran felt he was being made fool of and mocked by Leonard which to someone with his mindset was much harder to take than simply being outfought by someone. He simply gave up in the heat of the moment due to feeling embarrassed and in the realisation that Leonard was going to win the fight comfortably.

In the world Duran came from ie the street you can always square up with someone at a later date if they beat you the first time.

Cheers All.

 

Im sorry but cmon ...how is the guy who quit in the ring the tough guy...and the guy who made him quit the pu**y?

 

So this is another thread to excuse Duran for losing the rematch. And people wonder why I keep coming around saying what I say. I say the same things over and over because it does not change. Most fighters have troubles. Why is Duran different, and I thought he was this natural lightweight, so weighing in at 200 would not be logical.

 

Are you saying that it is fake news? Who knows?

I will say this,
It is very easy to put on a lot of weight in a short period of time, and it takes a lot longer to burn it off.

 

So what are you saying, that he was not a natural lightweight?