"Not many boxers could out-box Tunney at this stage of his career,but Loughran could"

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by McGrain, Jun 25, 2015.


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  1. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Was Loughran still a teenager when he met Tunney over 8 rounds? I think he might have been.

    Anyway, the above quote is from Jack Cavanaugh in his biography of Tunney. He shows the usual amount of bias to his subject, but still has to cop to Loughran out-lefting the supposed best left of his generation.

    Loughran's left hand has some reputation. Earned? Deserved?

    Was Loughran alone in his perceived ability to outbox Tunney or were/are there others who could turn the trick?

    Is Loughran doing Tunney up with that left hand if they meet over 15 two years later?
     
    McGrain, Jun 25, 2015
    McGrain, Jun 25, 2015
    #1
  2. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    Loughran got beaten by Tunney and knew it. After the fight he cried and apologized to his fans for not being able to do better. Thats not the reaction of a guy who was confident he won. In later life Loughran was one of those guys who could never admit he lost a fight. Ive seen him quoted as saying he beat Greb every time out (he didnt), beat Tunney (he didnt), and won several other fights he clearly lost. Id be interested in hearing his take on his gift decision over Roland Todd in New York.
     
    klompton2, Jun 25, 2015
    klompton2, Jun 25, 2015
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  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    All of New York found for Tunney and all of Philadelphia found for Loughran so far as I could see which means no further on.

    I've also read that Tunney declined 500k to meet Loughran, and if memory serves this was for the heavyweight title.
     
    McGrain, Jun 25, 2015
    McGrain, Jun 25, 2015
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  4. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Tunney was the better


     
    Mendoza, Jun 25, 2015
    Mendoza, Jun 25, 2015
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  5. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    He might have - but the second quote here is just form the Tunney bio. Literally one sentence before you chose to begin quoting, it reads - "While there could be no official decision, the majority of sportswriters at ringside - most of them from Philadelphia-area newspapers - gave their verdicts to Loughran."

    Followed by the bit you quoted.

    The bio definitely doesn't favour one result over the other and seems content with the no-decision.
     
    McGrain, Jun 25, 2015
    McGrain, Jun 25, 2015
    #5
  6. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    All of Philadelphia did not vote for Loughran. What New York papers were even at Philly for the fight?

    [url]http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/lccn/sn83045211/1922-08-25/ed-1/seq-15/[/url]

    "The weight was too much for me. I did not put up the bout of which I am capable but I have no alibis." -Tommy Loughran immediately after the fight.
     
    klompton2, Jun 25, 2015
    klompton2, Jun 25, 2015
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  7. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Loughran was a Philly guy. His nickname was "The Phantom of Philly"

    I think this could be an example of home town Philly news papers backing their man in a close fight that took place in Philly.

    I have read the news reviews and based on how boxing is scored today, Tunney wins on the 10 point must. He had a knockdown, and shook Loughran up a few times.

    Did the referee comment? Any news papers covering the match outside of New York and Philadelphia would be insightful.
     
    Mendoza, Jun 25, 2015
    Mendoza, Jun 25, 2015
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  8. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    The link says Tunney in front 4 rounds to 1 with 2 even heading into the final frame.
     
    Mendoza, Jun 25, 2015
    Mendoza, Jun 25, 2015
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  9. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    The Philadelphia Inquirer gave it to Loughran, the Philadelpia Record toTunney.
    Loughran had just 11 fights under his belt to Tunney's 53, and Tommy was 19 to Gene's 24. Plus at 163lbs Loughran was conceding 10lbs.
     
    mcvey, Jun 25, 2015
    mcvey, Jun 25, 2015
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  10. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    The Philadelphia record scored it for Tunney.
     
    mcvey, Jun 25, 2015
    mcvey, Jun 25, 2015
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  11. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Are you sure?


    It could have been, but without the film, how to know?

    Doesn't matter.

    Yeah, I agree - that would be interesting.


    But that's not really what the threads about. Loughran was experienced, but very young - and he seems to have been able to box with Tunney. I think that's pretty fascinating as, while both of them seem to have gotten better, Loughran would likely have got much better.
     
    McGrain, Jun 25, 2015
    McGrain, Jun 25, 2015
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  12. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    That's just counting decision bouts - Loughran had many more fights than that. He was probably out eleven times in 1920 alone.
     
    McGrain, Jun 25, 2015
    McGrain, Jun 25, 2015
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  13. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Yes you're right I found some more.He was still only 19 though.
     
    mcvey, Jun 25, 2015
    mcvey, Jun 25, 2015
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  14. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Right.
     
    McGrain, Jun 25, 2015
    McGrain, Jun 25, 2015
    #14
  15. Chuck1052

    Chuck1052 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Jack Cavanaugh's biography of Gene Tunney should not be relied on an authoritative source. Besides not going into enough depth about Tunney's boxing career or his life after boxing, Cavanaugh wrote that Jimmy Delaney had a boxing style similar to Jack Dempsey's while Dave Shade's style was similar to Tunney's. As a result, I wonder if Cavanaugh did much research or even read Tunney's autobiography, A Man Must Fight.

    In his autobiography, Tunney wrote about Delaney in connection with learning about Tommy Gibbons in preparation for a future bout with the latter. Both Gibbons and Delaney were from St. Paul, Minnesota and had simiar boxing styles, which in turn were similar to that of Tommy's brother, Mike Gibbons, a widely copied and admired boxer with tremendous skill. Delaney reportedly was a pupil of Mike and had worked out with Tommy. Although an avowed disciple of Mike Gibbons in his own right, Tunney wrote that he engaged Delaney to spar with him because the latter's style was similar to Tommy's, enabling Tunney pick up some pointers.

    Both Gene Tunney and Dave Shade knew how to fight and had safety-first styles. But Tunney was more of the stand-up boxer while Shade was well-known for his distinctive bob-and-weave style.

    - Chuck Johnston
     
    Chuck1052, Jun 25, 2015
    Chuck1052, Jun 25, 2015
    #15
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