Official Survey (Original 8 + ATG)

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Rumsfeld, Jun 22, 2020.


  1. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Fitz is a good parallel, though Armstrong does have strong claims on divisional standings too, with his boatload of defenses at 147.
     
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  2. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    Even not insisting on linearity, you'd struggle to find anyone who's been ranked number in 3 of the original 8.
     
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  3. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    I have edited it. Spellcheck ruined the word Pedroza.

    yes I have to address that. Can’t believe I forgot him.

    starling and Curry are decent though. Curry was a pound for pound guy who unified. Starling was a top guy.

    I think Pender is under rated actually. Solid fighter. He beat Robinson two out of two times when nobody else could and the fights were not disputed. Okay Robinson was old but until then he could beat almost anybody second time around.

    conteh should have won his first fight with Saad on cuts. There was foul play involved. Conteh did not lose to Mate Parlov. Saad was also a great fighter. I did include him. But he was never a better fighter than a prime Conteh in my view.

    thanks. I am happy to see your list now.
     
  4. asero

    asero Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    FLY
    1. Jimmy Wilde
    2. Pancho Villa
    3. Miguel Canto
    4. Ricardo Lopez
    5. Roman Gonzalez
    6. Pascual Perez
    7. Fidel LaBarba
    8. Benny Lynch
    9. Frankie Genaro
    10. Midget Wolgast
    11. Jung-Koo Chang
    12. Pongsaklek Wonjongkam
    13. Yoko Gushiken
    14. Chartchai Chiono
    15. Pone Kingpetch

    BANTAM
    1. Eder Jofre
    2. Ruben Olivares
    3. Fighting Harada
    4. Manuel Ortiz
    5. Carlos Zarate
    6. Nonito Donaire
    7. Panama Al Brown
    8. Pete Herman
    9. Kid Williams
    10. Lionel Rose
    11. Memphis Pal Moore
    12. Jeff Fenech
    13. Bud Taylor
    14. Rafael Marquez
    15. Naoua Inoue

    FEATHER
    1. Willie Pep
    2. Sandy Saddler
    3. Alexis Arguello
    4. George Dixon
    5. Terry McGovern
    6. Salvador Sanchez
    7. Erik Morales
    8. Juan Manuel Marquez
    9. Marco Antonio Barrera
    10. Wilfredo Gomez
    11. Abe Attell
    12. Vicente Saldivar
    13. Azumah Nelson
    14. Kid Chocolate
    15. Johnny Kilbane

    LIGHT
    1. Roberto Duran
    2. Benny Leonard
    3. Tony Canzoneri
    4. Joe Gans
    5. Pernell Whitaker
    6. Julio Cesar Chavez
    7. Ike Williams
    8. Packey McFarland
    9. Carlos Ortiz
    10. Freddie Welsh
    11. Lou Ambers
    12. Joe Brown
    13. Flash Elorde
    14. Beau Jack
    15. Sammy Mandell

    WELTER
    1. Sugar Ray Robinson
    2. Henry Armstrong
    3. Manny Pacquiao
    4. Sugar Ray Leonard
    5. Floyd Mayweather Jr.
    6. Mickey Walker
    7. Tommy Hearns
    8. Barney Ross
    9. Jimmy McLarnin
    10. Emile Griffith
    11. Jose Napoles
    12. Joe Walcott
    13. Jack Britton
    14. Ted Kid Lewis
    15. Kid Gavilan

    MIDDLE
    1. Harry Greb
    2. Bob Fitzsimmons
    3. Marvin Hagler
    4. Carlos Monzon
    5. Bernard Hopkins
    6. Charley Burley
    7. Stanley Ketchel
    8. Holman Williams
    9. Tommy Ryan
    10. Jake LaMotta
    11. **** Tiger
    12. Mike Gibbons
    13. Freedie Steele
    14. Canelo Alvarez
    15. Mike McCallum

    LHW
    1. Sam Langford
    2. Ezzard Charles
    3. Archie Moore
    4. Roy Jones Jr.
    5. Gene Tunney
    6. Michael Spinks
    7. Tommy Loughran
    8. Bob Foster
    9. Billy Conn
    10. Joe Calzaghe
    11. Jimmy Bivins
    12. Harold Johnson
    13. James Toney
    14. Tommy Gibbons
    15. Maxie Rosenbloom

    HW
    1. Muhammad Ali
    2. Joe Louis
    3. Rocky Marciano
    4. Evander Holyfield
    5. Larry Holmes
    6. Jack Dempsey
    7. Lennox Lewis
    8. Jack Johnson
    9. George Foreman
    10. Joe Frazier
    11. Mike Tyson
    12. Wladimir Klitschko
    13. Vitali Klitschko
    14. Sonny Liston
    15. Tyson Fury

    P4P
    1. Sugar Ray Robinson
    2. Harry Greb
    3. Sam Langford
    4. Henry Armstrong
    5. Muhammad Ali
    6. Manny Pacquiao
    7. Ezzard Charles
    8. Roberto Duran
    9. Joe Louis
    10. Sugar Ray Leonard
    11. Willie Pep
    12. Bob Fitzsimmons
    13. Floyd Mayweather Jr.
    14. Archie Moore
    15. Benny Leonard
    16. Tony Canzoneri
    17. Mickey Walker
    18. Jimmy Wilde
    19. Roy Jones Jr.
    20. Joe Gans
    21. Gene Tunney
    22. Tommy Hearns
    23. Barney Ross
    24. Marvin Hagler
    25. Jimmy McLarnin
     
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  5. Mike Cannon

    Mike Cannon Member Full Member

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    Forgive the pun, so you fought your corner well, made some salient points, as to my list, it would mirror Georges list almost like for like, the Napoles/ Rodrigues point not withstanding .
     
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  6. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    George has a good list actually. Wladimir Klitschko at 6 seems a bit high and Evander losing to Michael Moorer in his prime is not really like Joe Frazier losing to George Foreman. It should really put them both behind Marciano and Frazier. But it’s no big deal.

    Obviously the non champions like Gibbons, Langford were great fighters but I am not as comfortable finding them a divisional ranking even if I know they would beat a lot of champions.. defending a title takes extra responsibility, so I feel these kinds of guys are more pound for pound if you think they qualify.
     
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  7. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Interesting list. While I think his career at middleweight is enormously overrated by some, I'm startled not to see Robinson mentioned there at all.
     
  8. Webbiano

    Webbiano Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    @Rumsfeld

    Do you see any potential in doing the rest of the weight classes and not just the traditional 8 at any given time, or do you think that’s asking a bit much?
     
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  9. Mike Cannon

    Mike Cannon Member Full Member

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    Agree, entirely , the Sugar man of 50/51 would I think have beaten almost all, with the poss exception of Greb, Monzon, and Hagler.
     
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  10. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I actually think his style and toughness would be a terrible night for Hagler, though I consider Hagler the greater middleweight.
     
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  11. Webbiano

    Webbiano Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Just want to say it’s nice to see more and more posters getting involved in this. I must say personally my activity on this forum has been pretty scattered in the past 3/4 years and I totally understand we all have our own commitments, but it is warming to see us all get together and Have some healthy questions and discussions about each others lists. I’m really excited to see the end results!
     
  12. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    As am I. This type of thing has made me think outside the normal box a bit.
     
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  13. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    Maybe he's only ranked a fighter in one division.
     
  14. Saintpat

    Saintpat Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    @Rumsfeld trying to enter some subtle bias into the discussion for sure.

    I have Harry Truman higher than he does but I’m holding off on posting so there’s no shenanigans!

    (Seriously, I’ve begun toying around and will definitely participate. Week after the upcoming one I should have some free time to spend on this. Definitely count me in — someone has to stand up for Harry so he can Give ‘em Hell!!!!)
     
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  15. Webbiano

    Webbiano Boxing Junkie Full Member

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