Old Harry Wills Reaches The End Of The Line

It was a 6 rounder that was also reported as a draw I seem to remember. Either was a close bout. Miske's record against top fighters over this period included clear losses to Kid Norfolk and Greb. His best wins in this period were Morris, Dillon and a draw with Fulton.

No he did not. He was legally enforced to fight Wills and was ordered to do so or lose his HW title and still wriggled out of it on a technicality.

Dempsey: "I will never fight Harry Wills" after Wills tried to enforce his HW title elimination contract which stopped Dempsey defending his title for years. He'd rather not fight at all than fight Wills.

 

"By avoiding Godfrey, Wills never established himself as the best black fighter."

He had established that years earlier.

Also, Wills was not interested in being the best "black" fighter. He was interested in fighting for the heavyweight championship.

What would beating Godfrey have meant? Godfrey's biggest KO was over Fulton whom Wills KO'd years earlier when he was younger and better. Godfrey had lost two of three to Renault.

What happens if Wills fights and beats Tunney?

Dempsey defends against Sharkey.

No sense second-guessing Wills or his management because no matter what they did he was not getting a shot at the title.

Just my take on it.

"if Wills wanted . . . another shot at the title."

another?

Wills never got a first shot.

 

Wills won 3 eliminators against Fulton, Firpo and Norfolk. He was legally obliged a title shot and was sueing NYSAC for them to fulfill their contract.

Wills claimed Tunney and every white fighter of his day bar the ones who fought him wouldn't fight him and most clearly drew the colour line.

Most of those fighters you list are laughable.

Don't believe everything Rickard writes, as that's your main source.

 

Ed,

The counterpoint is Godfrey beat Uzcudun who beat Wills and did much better vs. Jack Sharkey. The black press at the time felt Godfrey would win.

I'd say Godfrey's KO over Gaines was a better win than Fulton.

The trouble with Godfrey is he likely threw a few matches so some of the losses are difficult to interpret. The Risko match I read was fixed. The DQ losses were mostly vs. low blows on fixed fights.

The 4 best heavies of the 20's were likely Dempsey, Wills, Godfrey, and Tunney. Wills had a chance to fight two of them. All we saw was Tunney handling Dempsey at the end of his career.

I do not think Wills would have beaten Tunney. Wills by that time was badly beaten by Sharkey.

I do blame Wills and his management a bit. He could have risked more to create a higher purse where Kearns and Dempsey would have said okay or called Dempsey's management's bluff a bit louder than he did.

 

32? Wills is usually stated to have been born in 1889, which would make him 35 against Firpo. Against Firpo Wills completely neutralised a guy who had just gone life and death with Dempsey and had been a hair's breadth away from knocking him out, won by a near shut out and knocked him down twice.

Godfrey was pretty much a nobody until 1925, losing almost as often as he was winning and got flattened twice by an ancient Langford as well as such legends as Battling Norfolk and Jack Townsend. At the close of 1924 his record was 15-9-1 with five losses by KO and he'd lost four of his last seven fights. Hardly someone in a position to be calling out a top contender. So what he called Wills out. That doesn't mean he had to fight him. Did Dempsey fight Godfrey? Did Tunney? Godfrey called out Tunney too.

Tunney later admitted his calling out of Wills was a sham solely to make him look more credible for Dempsey. This is the guy who was on record saying he would never a fight a black opponent and claimed he had never even had a black sparring partner.

 

I don't buy that. Tunneys challenge to Wills was carried in every sports section of every newspaper nationwide. If Wills had accepted what's the response? "Just kidding"?

 

Probably. That's what Dempsey did.

He said he'd fight the winner of Firpo vs Wills.

 

I wouldn't rate Godfrey amongst the top 4 of the 20s.

 

No it isn't, that's a statement Rickard made, that's your source, unless you have others, again maybe Tunney's manager making a claim. None of that is impartial, all have vested interests to make Tunney look a legit challenger.

Oh wait, Tunney's manager claiming Tunney will NEVER face Wills:

https://news.google.com/newspapers?...AIBAJ&sjid=yZcFAAAAIBAJ&pg=5464,3970490&hl=en

And Tunney ofcourse is on record of 'disapproving of mixed bouts', turning down a Godfrey bout on that basis.

Again Wills claimed Tunney wouldn't fight him, Tunney never entered the ring against a black opponent and his manager said Tunney would never face Wills all while Wills was no1 rated HW.

As it is, why would Wills be trying to fight Tunney when he has a contract and NYSAC order to fight the HW Champion?

There was talk of Wills-Tunney for the the HW title with Dempsey being stripped. Wills/Mullins probably wanted that and the lions share given his no1 contender status.

Dempsey fans seem to believe Dempsey was intent on signing to fight Wills. So why would Wills sign to fight Tunney or Godfrey when not only was he mandatory but Dempsey also had signed a contract to fight Wills that Mullins still believed Fitzsimmons and Dempsey would deliver.

That's irrelevant, Wills had already agreed mandatory status with NYSAC and Rickard put them forward as the best shots to beat Wills as eliminators

@edward morbius has already explained this

It was also an eliminator according to @Janitor. Not sure on his source

Not when Wills fought Fulton and Norfolk they weren't. When Wills manager was trying to force Dempsey/Rickard to upkeep their legal obligation to defend against Wills, they may have been.

I'm not sure if either were rater above Firpo when Wills fought him but as stated already Rickard picked the fighter he thought had the best shot to beat Wills and it wasn't Gibbons or Renault, it was Firpo.

 

https://news.google.com/newspapers?...AIBAJ&sjid=mCEEAAAAIBAJ&pg=3110,7503662&hl=en

and:

Schmelling said Tunney wouldn't spar with blacks and:

Description: [ Autographs ] GENE TUNNEY Unbelievable racist content T.L.S. "Gene" on his business letterhead, 2pp. 4to., Stamford, Apr. 8, 1949 to his close friend Robert Gros in which Tunney sets forth his views on the inequality of the races. In very small part: "...I have learned a great deal about the Negro problem since I have taken this job...the American Negro is no more like his African cousins...than we are like Neanderthal men. The American Negro, without exception, has a good infusion of white blood...[he] is a development of physical selection.Women slaves were serviced by men slaves, just as mares of the racetrack are serviced by great sires. This accounts for much of the physical superiority of the Negro...The intelligent man's objection tothe Negro [is based] on his cultural immaturity...[they] will be accepted by Americans just as soon as he proves his equality culturally and spiritually...Men are not created equal. Not one percent of the people of the world are gifted with brains enough to contribute to the progress of the world..." Near fine condition.

http://www.invaluable.com/auction-lot/autographs-gene-tunney-unbelievable-racist-co-1-c-suhckp3zn1

These must be end of year results, and even then it's arguable because it's the The Ring, a magazine, a subjective list. At the end of 1924 Godrey's record is gatekeeper at best. He'd been ko'd twice by Langford in 20/21 (a fighter you consider shot at this stage), never avenged that, he beat Tate and Thompson

Care to tell us when exactly Norfolk earned a shot at the number 1 contender?

3 fights, 1 draw, 2 early ko losses.I doubt that was really Godfrey's second fight

Townsend was a nobody

The only time you can consider Godfrey a legit contender was late 1925 when Wills was in discussions with Dempsey about a title shot

 

Also pretty damning, Rickards telegrams telling Dempsey 'Tunney will be an easier fight than Wills and you can even pick your own referee and judges'

The first contract offer between Dempsey-Tunney was in January 7th 1926 and the final agreement was in March 31st 1926 all before Rickard came to the press claiming he was offering Wills an elimination against Tunney

All in court documents reported here:

http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums...Nov20193020Grayscale20-202388_zpsc350a2ec.jpg

Puts to bed the supposed contract offer from Tunney to Wills once and for all doesn't it @mcvey?