Once and for all, change the name. These guys do not descend from Joe Louis.

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by choklab, Dec 7, 2022.


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  1. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    The weigh in was the same day back then.

    On the night most “cruisers” are around Joe Fraziers weight. And you know it.

    Frazier was a heavyweight. And like heavyweights who turn pro, they remain heavyweights even though the division is called cruiser. They don’t stop being heavyweights just because it’s “called” something else!
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2022
    choklab, Dec 11, 2022
    choklab, Dec 11, 2022
    #46
  2. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace

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    But that's not what you said.

    You want the heavyweight division relabelled SHW and cruiser division relabelled HW.

    So anyone fighting above 200 is, by your definition a SHW.

    I just don't think it's appropriate labelling Joe Frazier a SHW, even though he did fight above the divisional limit of your new definitions.
     
    lufcrazy, Dec 11, 2022
    lufcrazy, Dec 11, 2022
    #47
  3. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    Frazier is not a SHW. That’s right. If the divisions were relabelled the right way Frazier would fight in the HW division today. I thought you would be happy with that? Nobody wants 220lb “cruisers”. Those guys are Heavyweights.
     
    choklab, Dec 11, 2022
    choklab, Dec 11, 2022
    #48
  4. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace

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    So 220lbs is heavyweight now? I thought 200lbs was the cut off for SHW?
     
    lufcrazy, Dec 11, 2022
    lufcrazy, Dec 11, 2022
    #49
  5. Wass85

    Wass85 Active Member banned Full Member

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    The last thing we need is another division, if a SHW division was created that's where all the lustre and prestige would be so HW's would just move up to SHW anyway, a pointless quest.
     
    Wass85, Dec 11, 2022
    Wass85, Dec 11, 2022
    #50
  6. mirexxa

    mirexxa Heavyweight Champ Full Member

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    lol this guy is debating what a division should be called. get a life
     
    mirexxa, Dec 11, 2022
    mirexxa, Dec 11, 2022
    #51
    MarkusFlorez99 likes this.
  7. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    No. 200lb is sufficient. You know that higher “in the ring weight” can be achieved. With 220 realistically being the highest the scales can be cheated. Just as it is now in the incorrectly labelled cruiserweight division, which is actually heavyweight. Just like it is named in Olympic boxing.
     
    choklab, Dec 11, 2022
    choklab, Dec 11, 2022
    #52
  8. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    You are right. What it needs is the two existing divisions above light heavyweight to be relabelled.
     
    choklab, Dec 11, 2022
    choklab, Dec 11, 2022
    #53
  9. JunlongXiFan

    JunlongXiFan Boxing Addict Full Member

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    You can cheat way over 20 pounds. McDonnell weighed 144 vs Inoue in their fight, that's a 26 pound cut out of 144 pounds. Realistically it's very possible to cut from 235 with good genetics and extreme effort.
     
    JunlongXiFan, Dec 11, 2022
    JunlongXiFan, Dec 11, 2022
    #54
  10. Wass85

    Wass85 Active Member banned Full Member

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    Renaming them wouldn't change anything though would it, what would be the point?
     
    Wass85, Dec 11, 2022
    Wass85, Dec 11, 2022
    #55
  11. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace

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    So anyone who fought above 220 ceases to be a heavyweight according to you?

    So the rematch between Frazier and Foreman was two SHW fighters going at it?
     
    lufcrazy, Dec 11, 2022
    lufcrazy, Dec 11, 2022
    #56
  12. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    That fight was not a title fight. And the division, as it was then, had yet to be Invaded by an influx of SHWs turning pro.

    once SHWs turned pro, Cruiserweight effectively becomes heavyweight. As we know Scales can be cheated up to 220 or so.
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2022
    choklab, Dec 11, 2022
    choklab, Dec 11, 2022
    #57
  13. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace

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    I never said it was a title fight.

    However its two fighters weighing above 220 therefore its two SHWs according to Choklab logic.

    Larry Holmes vs Bonecrusher Smith, all time famous SHW bout.

    Ali was a SHW vs Bob Foster also wasn't he?
     
    lufcrazy, Dec 11, 2022
    lufcrazy, Dec 11, 2022
    #58
  14. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    The point is that it would not only mean weight categories would again be in tune with Olympics but also that the general public could recognise SHW is unrelated to Heavyweight and the history of that division. The 200 pounders would benefit from the prestige of not being called cruiserweights.
     
    choklab, Dec 11, 2022
    choklab, Dec 11, 2022
    #59
  15. Wass85

    Wass85 Active Member banned Full Member

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    But there would have no prestige because SHW would be the new ultimate division, fighters would still want to take the glory by facing the big guys, it would kill the legacy of the HW division.
     
    Wass85, Dec 11, 2022
    Wass85, Dec 11, 2022
    #60
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