ow much prime/near prime film do we have of Ezzard Charles?

OK i will say it, charles was excelent against marciano, his legs, stamina and ability to absorb punishment held up terificaly in the first fight with marciano, but most people have only seen reduced highlights that do not emphasize this to the degree of recomending it as a career highlight. It was so dificult to look good against marciano, but charles actualy did look good and brought his "a game" first time around. check this HD version, charles had an excelent moments, especialy round 4.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IksKG80ER9o[/ame]






As for charles's "hundred fights" consider that charles was really on his second career which stated after a 3 year break from boxing. with his new record Charles was 55-7 against marciano who was 45-0 and only 2 years younger..Both charles and marciano started around the same time after the war only differance was Charles also had a breif career before the war.

 

atsch

-Hegrant still finding ways to let us know how much he absolutey hates living in a world where Rocky Maricano was not only once a Heavyweight Champion but went down as an all time great.

-Nobody mentions the Marciano footage because they were losing efforts that saw him take heavy punishment, the second fight being a fairly brutal almost one sided beat down.

 

:good Charles put up a great effort first time around. He pushe marciano prety close.There is no shame in losing to another great fighter.

 

In 1942, Charles arguably was the foremost Light-Heavyweight in the world. With wins over Booker Beckwith, Jose Basora and Joey Maxim. And a KO over Anton Christoforidis. It ain't a shabby list of foes, considering Booker Beckwith was a top ranked Light-Heavyweight, Basora, a middleweight, was dubbed the 'Hardest puncher in boxing', and Maxim was a top Heavyweight prospect. He also beat Mose Brown a high ranking Light Heavyweight.

This was more than enough to raise Charles to the top of the Light-Heavyweight rankings, at a time when it was not at its best. At one point in late 1942, the four outstanding contenders for the Light-Heavyweight crown was Bivins, Charles, Christoforidis and Mose Brown. Charles had beaten 2 out of the other 3 contenders by KO, and was only a mere Middleweight at the time!

Bivins big claim to the title was that he had beaten Lesnevich in a non-title bout and Lesnevich publically declared he would never fight Bivins again. So, taking into account Lesnevich's testimoney, Charles was by far the most logical contender for the Light Heavyweight crown during the second part of 1942.

It is a travesty Bivins or Charles never got as shot at that title in 1942.

 

as always, insightful and well written post:thumbsup

 

But In 1943 charles bombed, he never won a fight that year, he hit a wall. ezzard was knocked down 16 times in the only 2 fights he had, proving he peaked too soon or he was simply in the wrong weight class. Either way he'd burned out. The war came at the right time for charles because he could rest his body for 3 years and mature into a genuine lightheavyweight who was still growing. If the early 1940s was when Charles peaked then you are talking about his first 2 years as a pro because you cant include 1943 as charles never won a fight that year.

 

atsch The title was frozen from march 1942 because the champion was away at war until 1945 and was not ready to defend again until 1946.

 

Inbred one, try answering a question or making a point on it's own merit ... it might push you past your fifth grade education but you can use the help ... point is that no one said that the footage contained a PRIME Charles so basically a pist prime Charles gave your boy such a rough fight ..

 

Except you're dodging the point Choke ... no one is denying Charles put up a terrific fight .. my point is a NON-PRIME Charles did it ... let's try and stay on point ...

 

Second career , like in comeback ? Get real please ... if you want to be taken for real, start with honest posts ... the man was reinventing himself because he was older, broke, had to fight for money, past his prime .... same **** time and again .. the Charles that fought Marciano, like the Walcott, Moore and the Louis had shot legs and could not fight their prime fight, they had to improvise which resulted in taking far more risks and absorbing far more punishment then thenywould have had to in their primes. Anyone but a Marciano nughugger knows this as a fact.

 

so I am a dishonest nuthugger for pointing out a fact you overlook for your own agenda that at 24 years of age ezzard charles was NOT older, broke with shot legs when he returned to the ring after the war?

If charles second career launched at age 24 was a "comeback" then Charles retired at 21. If a short career ends at 21 and starts again after a 3 year break it is a new career.

The marciano fights started the real decline in charles.


in charles next 18 fights (over 36 months) after losing the title he faced 11 at that time rated contenders. he was 14-4 in these 18fights and knocked out 4 of the 7 rated contenders he beat. The fights he lost were either robberies or could have went either way.

this means ezzards 1951-54 win ratio is neglegable against his 1946-51 record and his KO percentage was actualy higher in the 36 months since losing the title against at that time rated contenders.

where as in 1955 charles fought 11 times. altogether he fought 3 times in december, 2 times in aprill and august each. unsurprisingly charles only won 6 times out of the 11. he fought 8 rated heavyweights that year and did not knock out any of them.... this was when he faded. after marciano.

 

Cheers, I have being doing a lot of research on Charles recently, hence the info.

I agree 1943 was disastrous. But in 1942 Charles was the premier fighter in the Light-Heavyweight class (barring Bivins), he established himself as the second most qualified contender.

It could be argued that Charles had injuries or was out of shape going into his 1943 losses. However, it is a bit of a coincidence the best fighters he fought in his career beat him here. I'd say he wasn't the talent he would become but he was not far off of it. As beating Burley, Maxim, Christoforidis, Beckwith, Basora and Brown is definitely not the form of a relative novice. it is quite clear Charles was nearing his prime.

I agree he improved after the war, I just don't think it is as much as some think. Although admittedly I haven't done that much research (yet) on Charles post-1942.

I have an article from the NBA claiming only three were frozen and Lesnevich was not among the champions named. He also scheduled a few title bouts whilst in the Coastguards, and was giving time a few times to defend his title. Before the Charles vs Mose Brown bout, Lesnevich's manager stated that Lesnevich would have some time to defend his title, and may defend it against the winner of the bout, and Charles' promotor after winning issued an unheeded challenge.

Lesnevich certainly had time to defend his title but chose not to. Most people in the same position would act as he did.

 

Always a laugh with "second careers". There is no way you can construe a fighter taking a year+ break off from training and fighting consistently to be beneficial on the whole to their game. If you don't keep a sword sharp and oiled it will rust and easily get nicked. Charles,Leonard, Louis, Ali, Conn, and others are clear examples of this IMO. Even the occasional exhibition matches aren't really the same. All of these persons were physically affected by these layoffs. Even if they managed to stay in decent shape.

Charles may have needed some time to recuperate from the ridiculous pace and competition of his pre war career but that long is probably a little too long.

 

The ring anual ratings clearly show that the title was frozen from early 1942, all of 1943 and 1944 and most of 1945. Lesenevich did not return to the ring until 1946, he fought 4 times that year but only once to defend his title against mills the other fights were against heavyweights oma and woodcock who both beat him and #5 LH joe kahut who he stopped in an overweight match.

In british promoter jack solomons book he talked of visiting new york to sign lesnevich for a fight with his fighter mills. ezzard charles's people made it clear to solomons that lesnevich would not be leaving america without fighting charles but jack managed to get away with it because his guarantee was bigger.

without facing charles in 1947 lesnevich was still named ring magazine fighter of the year for knocking out his #1 contender billy fox and the #1 and #7 heavyweight contenders mauriello and bettina which was considered outstanding. Charles was also by then fighting as many heavyweights himself but lost narowly to elmer ray that year.

 

some fighters turn pro at 24 which is how old charles was after a 3 year break from a breif career that begun when he was in high school. All the fighters you mentioned were older and fought way longer than that when they returned from a simular break.