P4P better

His resume is LACKING big time at 168 imo.. Hearns has a better resume than RJJ imo. Hearns faced more ATGs when they were in prime or close to it. RJJ should have fought Benn and Collins. You get on this RJJ high horse kick with all these excuses/ reasons why RJJ was at 168 for 2 years and missed some better guys.. why? .. He did. The Hearns ducking McCallum comparison is laughable because Hearns was going up and down in weight taking on ATG's. ROY WASNT . He was there for 2 years... Hearns wasnt ...

All I said was originally that RJJ resume is lacking at 168, then the other idiot says Hearns vacates 160 when the division is starting to heat up ... LOL ,, he obviously didn't follow his career as MW was HEARNS worst WEIGHT.. what a stupid ****ing thing to say .. he already VACATED IT

 

Hill wasn't ranked p4p going into the fight as far as I can see, but Nunn was: https://boxrec.com/wiki/index.php/The_Ring_Magazine's_Annual_Ratings:_Pound_For_Pound--1990s

Hill was ranked in 1989, though, but Nunn was higher ranked

Anyhow, the gist was that I don't really believe Hearns fled MW in the late 80's any more than I believe that Jones fled to 175 to get away from... Steve Collins. My point was that such accusations are fairly baseless and silly.

 

I'm quite sure that Jones would have gotten a lot of crap for it if he beat Benn after McClellan. He'd be accused of waiting him out until he was damaged goods.

And while Benn was a savage who ducked no one, I wonder how keen he was on facing Jones after being through that hell with McClellan. I've never heard anything really concrete about it. Collins has been very vocal about wanting Roy, though.

 

Exactly. This is why RJJ legacy suffers.. He certainty taking more crap for taking the likes of the Vinny Pazienzas of the world over Benn and Collins.

 

Nobody has said that Roy fought better opponents or that his resume isn’t lacking.

That’s not the argument.

The argument, is you giving a pass to Hearns for his decision making and his circumstances, but then not allowing the same for Roy.

The argument is you labelling Roy as being a cherry picker, without any evidence whatsoever.

The reason he only stayed at SMW for 2 years, is because late in 1996, he couldn’t unify the division with Liles, Collins and Nardiello.

So he went to LHW, where after having a fight with McCallum, he fought an undefeated fighter who’d beaten Toney, with his sights then set on a huge unification with Virgil Hill.

Now I have provided lots of evidence over the years, that he tried to fight Liles, Dariusz and Hopkins.

Actual evidence, with specific information from various respected sources who were present at the time.

Again, he absolutely wasn’t protected, and he didn’t cherry pick.

 

But he tried to fight better fighters than Collins.

I have proof of that.

Also, name me ANY fighter in the sport’s history.

Anyone.

Give me any name.

Then I’ll give you a name of somebody who they missed/didn’t fight.

You can literally do it with anyone in history.

Even Greb who had over 300 fights.

 

Of course it's different... Hearns was going up and down in weight for 18 years taking on ATG's . He didnt campaign for 2 years straight at any weight after WW , like Roy did.

I originally said that RJJ resume is lacking at 168. GO LOOK !!!. but later ramped it up to cherry picking because the comparison to Hearns is a joke.

 

If Hearns wasnt going up and down in weight taking on big fights, Duran, Benetiz, Hagler, SRL , etc ..... If he missed all those , then of course I would say not facing McCallum is a duck ///// But the fights he was taking , gives him that reason you cant fight everyone

But hell if you are taking on the Vinny Pazienzas of the world, then you dont get that pass, imo. Roy missed the better guys for lesser ones. imo ...

Especially when a McCallum fight would have been for less money.. and a Benn fight probably would have been for more

 

Everybody has different circumstances.

Now read this clearly, so there’s no confusion:

I personally don’t think that Hearns ducked Mike. He went for the more prestigious, bigger money fights.

The issue is:

You have given him a pass for his circumstances, but then you won’t allow them for Roy.

Now that is ignorance.

And it doesn’t matter who Hearns fought in comparison to Roy.

It’s very simple:

If you’re going to allow circumstances for one fighter, but then not the other, then you simply aren’t being in any way objective.

You have said that Roy cherry picked at SMW, before moving up.

But he didn’t.

He fought Toney, and then he moved up to LHW, as Liles blew a fight, and he couldn’t fight Nardiello and Collins at the time.

Now feel free to come and refute that if you don’t agree.

 

Also Mikle fight when have been for less money, Benn fight would have been more for Roy .. ITS DIFFERENT.. Hearns had the bigger fights , Roy didnt ,, its different ...

roy was there for 2 years, hearns wasnt

 

It doesn’t matter.

Me and Bokaj have only used Mike as an example.

Once again, Liles blew the fight. That is coming from the guy’s own manager.

He was then faced with not being able to fight Nardiello or Collins for the other belts at the time.

So his choices were:

To defend his IBF in a mandatory.

To take some time out.

To take a keep busy fight against whoever.

Fight McCallum at LHW, before targeting Griffin and Hill.

Now he did the latter, but you are saying that he was a protected cherry picker.

 

It is not about a direct comparison.

I agree with you regarding Hearns.

Again, it’s about you ALLOWING for Hearns’ circumstances, but then not even caring what we’ve said about Roy’s

It’s not about a direct comparison.

It’s about you not being objective.

Yes, we know about Hearns’ circumstances.

Now look at Roy’s.

He moved up, because he could not get a shot at the other belts, in order to unify the division.

Do you understand that?

Liles wouldn’t fight him.

Neither would Collins and Nardiello at the time.

The fights weren’t viable.

But he didn’t stay at SMW to fight whoever else was available.

He instead took on a new challenge at LHW.

Now those were not the actions of a protected cherry picker.

 

Dosent matter to you. But I just gave why it matters to me, 4 differences, Roys resumes after Toney at 168 is soft imo. He could have challenged himself more and thus his legacy suffers for it imo. Hearns missing Mike , when taking on SRL, Duran , Hagler and Benetiz .. is different than Vinny Paz. thats why Hearns Legacy dosent suffer for missing Mike, imo

I have never said anything about RJJ outside of 168.

 

This is getting tiresome and ridiculous now.

You say that he could have challenged himself more at SMW.

How many more times do I need to say this:

Frankie Liles wouldn’t fight him.

Do you understand that?

There was only a tiny window for Benn, who declined rapidly afterwards.

Gerald was done.

Calzaghe wasn’t there.

There was only Collins with the WBO, and Nardiello with the WBC.

Again, he couldn’t get those fights.

So HOW could he have challenged himself more at SMW??

He couldn’t.

But he challenged himself by moving up to LHW.

Now you have made the claims that he was a protected cherry picker.

Therefore, the onus is on you to prove it.

With some actual, credible evidence.

Also, you keep using Paz as an example, which doesn’t work.

Simply because that is not being objective.

You compare Benitez etc, and say things like “It doesn’t matter if Hearns missed Mike, as he’d fought Duran and Leonard etc instead”

That is not fair.

Because although Roy missed Collins, he’d fought Toney and Hopkins, he’d tried to fight Liles, and then he went on to fight Hill, before then trying to fight Dariusz and Hopkins again.

Surely you can see that.

 

I am being objective, If Hearns campaigned only at 154 for 2 years straight, he is fighting McCallum. His sights was on Hagler in 83 , and that fight postponed for 2 years to 85. After Toney, Roy didnt do much at 168. No Benn. That is NOT Hearns .. Are you saying Roy is making significantly less money if he fights Benn or Collins over the others? That is your claim? Because if Duran fought Mike , his payday 500,000 grand .... and almost 2 million if he fights Hearns.. Figure it out, Mike was a distraction who priced himself outta fights. Are you saying RJJ makes 4 times more fighting Byrd or Thorton or Paz than Benn or Collins? Bokajs an idiot who dosent understand that Hearns was up in down in weight for 18 years taking big fights. Roy didnt do that at 168. Roys resume at 168 after Toney is lacking imo . AGAIN


ps , you shouldnt have brought up money to prove your point! It just backfired big time !! and whatever you do dont let Bokaj manage your money, you will leave 7 million on the table. Hearns should have fought McCallum was it?

Both men were well compensated for their efforts. Hagler was guaranteed $5.6 million and 45 percent of the gross over $14 million, while Hearns was paid $5.4 million and 35 percent of the gross over $14 million. With the fight grossing $20 million -- third all-time behind Holmes-Cooney's $22 million and the $20.5 million tally that came with Leonard-Hearns I -- that meant Hagler cleared $8.3 million to Hearns' $7.5 million.