Pacquiao against the 80s fab four...

How do I overrate them? Because I picked them to defeat Pacquiao? As for your statement that they all lost their most important fights your way off, what a load of BS. Concerning the Chacon/Olivares fights, in their first bout he was doing very well until Ruben`s body punching took their toll and Bobby was forced to retire in his corner. Also, Chacon did more partying than training leading up to that fight as he underestimated Ruben who was coming off two losses to Rafael Herrera the year before.

Bobby told himself that he was on the slide and since they had sparred together before and Bobby had always gotten the better of Ruben, he figured he had nothing to worry about even though his trainer Joe Ponce told him otherwise as he knew that Ruben never looked good in sparring no matter who they put him in against. What Bobby failed to realise however was that Ruben had something to prove after those two losses and trained harder than ever for their fight, which was a rarity as Ruben hated training.

Bobby should have learned his lesson that night to never underestimate a clever and experienced veteran such as Ruben, unfortunately for him he did not as their second bout proved. Going into the rematch Bobby had to lose a significant amount of weight with less than a week to go as he again did more partying than training much to the dismay of Joe Ponce, as he believed that after Ruben`s KO loss to Arguello he had finally reached the end of the line.

He did not anticipate however having so much difficulty losing the excess pounds, and even though he made the weight come fight time he had nothing to offer and was bombed out with embarassing ease by Ruben who once again actually did train and take the fight seriously as he was looking to secure another title. I ain`t making excuses here for Chacon, but everything you have just read here is true and I know this due to having spoken to people who were close to Bobby and saw the behind the scenes shenanigans and arguments he had with Ponce leading up to both fights.

Now against Boza it is true that his face was battered and bloodied in the rematch, but what does that have to do with anything? Chacon won the fight did he not? And let us not forget what a high paced battle that was and that Boza threw a ridiculous amount of punches in that fight, I think he was averaging close to a hundred punches a round... when did Pacquiao ever throw so much leather in any of his fights at 130? Never thats when, so your point is moot.

And unlike Pacquiao, Chacon was never fazed by the sight of his own blood and in fact it seemed to light a fire within him whereas the Filipino has shown on a few occasions now that he could be unsettled by the sight of his. Pacquiao may be a p4p fighter in this day and age, but I doubt he would have been a destroyer among the crop of fighters I mentioned back then. He would have won some and lost some, I just happen to think he would have lost more than he would have won is all and I don`t care wether you like it or not.

 

And Mendoza, you really ought to get a hold of some Boza fights as he was much better than you made him out to be although I won`t hold it against you as you admitted not being very familiar with him. But believe Corny was a top guy in a deep era and was a very good fighter. He was always in great condition and while his chin was not made of stone, he wasnt an easy guy to get out of there by any means and he also had a very good jab although he often neglected to use it.

 

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While it is true that Limon was there to be hit, I don`t see how Pacquiao takes him out early. Navarrete for my money hit harder punch for punch than Pac as did Alexis and neither man was able to hurt Limon much less floor him in 23 combined rounds of fighting and landing everything but the kitchen sink on him. And don`t forget all the leather that Choi landed on him either, and the Korean was another guy who in my opinion hit harder than Pac and he landed PLENTY of flush power shots right on the point of his chin without so much as making him blink. I stick by what I said, Limon while wide open defensively is all wrong for Pacquiao.

Pac is vulnerable to the body and can be hurt there and Limon invested heavily to the body in all of his fights, and Pac isn`t exactly hard to hit either and too many of those bolo punches to the midsection are bound to slow him down at which point Rafael will start landing with more regularity. As for Boza I agree that if he meets Pac head on and tries to brawl with him he gets taken out, but if he fights a smart, disciplined fight like he did against Limon to win the title he does stand a chance, especially if he uses his jab to offset Pacquiaos rythm. But I will concede that if Pac does land often enough he would get him out of there, but I won`t dissmiss Boza`s chances entirely in this one if again, he fights smart tactical fight.

As for Bobby I don`t see him having a hard time finding a home for his right hand, and once Pacquiao tastes a few of them right on the kisser I think he will think twice before coming in as aggressively as he usually would. Bobby also threw the right very well to the body and I can see him taking some steam out of his quicker footed foe down the stretch with it. Pacquiao does have the power to hurt Bobby and hurt him he will, but he always came back firing with both fists and he would make him pay a price for his pound of flesh.

I recognize that all these guys had their flaws and weren`t invincible, and if they fought a series against the Filipino they would win and lose some, but Pacquiao does have some glaring flaws of his own that can and would be exploited by this quartet as well. Pacquiao is quite predictable and does not have great punch variety, and like I said before he is vulnerable to the body and can be hurt by a good punch to the chin as well, but his great conditioning sees him recover quickly in most cases. But all four of these guys could punch and I do not see him steamrolling any of them, he might win but he would definately know he was in a fight each time and wouldn`t walk unscathed against any of them.

 

About the Boza/Limon fight, while it is true that there were times when Bo sat down on his punches, for the first half of the fight he successfully boxed his man and it was really only in the last five/six rounds that they started going toe to toe. And the reason for that was again due to Limon`s body of work downstairs which slowed Boz down enough by the last third of the fight to make it easier for Limon to get in close and force Corny to slug it out with him.

And I don`t really agree with the consensus that Limon was slow with his hands, not all the time anyways. When he opened up on his man and let his hands go he could throw them bolo punches pretty darn fast in my opinion, although he usually needed to trap his man against the ropes before he opened up like that. As for Pacquiao vs Bobby I know he ain`t just gonna collapse and panic once he is in a firefight and I wasn`t trying to imply it.

But I do think Bobby has the power to get his respect and make him back away and have to reset if he is nailed with a good one right on the button. He did this against JMM most recently, and has done so in other fights as well. His fast hands will be an advantage for him and he can and likely will surpirse and drop Bobby once or twice, but if he is in the same spartan physical condition he was in for Bazooka IV and Boza the second time around I do think he will weather those occasional storms and recover fairly quickly.

Either way, I guess I am in the minority here and thats okay, it ain`t the first time and it ain`t going to be the last and I`m sticking to my guns. But whenever I look at Pac I just don`t see a great fighter before my eyes. I see a superbly conditioned, quick fisted power puncher but one who is rather predictable with his offense and who leaves himself open to counters. But countering is not the way to beat Pac unless you have one punch KO power, as he is still coming forward and gaining momentum while looking to knock your head off.

You have to get this guy on the backfoot as his power and offense is completed nullified then, and I still maintain that a peak Morales would have his number 8/9 times out of ten, as would a Limon type of fighter. If you have an iron chin and/or superb powers of recovery and aren`t afraid to go on the offensive against Pacquiao he can be beat. Anyway, good debate as always and I thank those who took the time to post their thoughts.