i usually just read what everyone else says and don't make too many comments. but i have noticed pavlik threads starting to trickle back in so i figured i would share an observation...there is one thing i havent noticed and that is anyone's opinion about jack loew. does anyone think he's taken pavlik as far as he can? maybe pav needs a top shelf trainer to show him how to adapt and do more than just move forward, double jab and straight right a la floyd sr. and ricky? he has the ability to be champ for a long time but i think maybe he and jack have gone as far as they can. loew has never trained pav or anyone else to fight someone like bhop and i almost think bhop exposed loew as much as pavlik....thoughts???? ps if there has been a post about loew then sorry...im on here almost daily and havent seen one
You make a fine point and is one I've too been wondering. The Brass at Top Rank have been trying to force out Leow since the Zertuche fight if I'm not mistaken. Also with Jim Lampley saying himself after the rebroadcast of the fight that Bernard wants to take Kelly under his wing and show him personally what was wrong etc, even saying B-Hop would pick him up and drive him to the gym if he had to. Hermit may have the best feel for this, he's usually got the goods on the Youngstown Low Down. But Kelly has always INSISTED loyalty to Jack, and would not be surprised to see him stay that way.
Loew must go. Simple as that. That was the sweet version. Loew should go back and do what he knows best. That was the harsh version. From Pavlik's point of view, and I think there's still room for improvement, so the sooner the change the better it'll do for his career. Hopkins/Nazim would be an excellent combo.
that's what I'd figure. Any truth floatin' around about the Lampley comments? Maybe Jack is welcome to come along?
The folks closer to the situation insist Kelly will never get rid of Lowe. I've been advocating a 'co trainer' situation myself. Especially periods between fights. Get another perspective to bring back to the home gym.
You get my PM from last night? I've noticed sometimes they take a few days to show up. Strange stuff.
Okay -- I'll weigh in. Pipe Wrenched is only partially right. Cameron Dunkin has been trying to push Leow out since BEFORE Kelly signed with Top Rank. That was almost immediately after Taylor eliminated Kelly from the Olympic trials. At the time Pav had the attitude that him and Jack are a package deal. Jack Leow and Mike Pavlik SR managed KP from child to champion, and that is a hell of a back story. Jack and Kelly have been together since Kelly was 9 years old. In other words, Kelly has had Jack in his corner for two thirds of his life. A split seems highly unlikely. In addition, I think that a lot of Pavlik's stabilty and work ethic arises from his relationships with the people around him, so a split may be unwise. Jack Leow, Cameron Dunkin, Mike SR, and Bob Arum turned Kelly from a prospect who had a rough time with Zuniga into one of only a handful of people to win a world title at 160 while still undefeated. Not only did Kelly win a word title while still undefeated, he won it from another undefeated fighter who beat Hopkins twice. No need to reinvent the wheel here. If your Harley engine needs a tune-up, you don't build a new shop. A departure from Top Rank doesn't seem very likely. Hopkins is a Golden Boy guy, so nothing will ever materialize from all the talk about a BHop/Pavlik relationship On the other hand, Jack needs to grow as a trainer just as much as Kelly needs to grow as a fighter. Kelly ended the McKart fight, and the first Taylor fight by doing exactly what his corner told him to. Both times the instructions came from Miguel Diaz, not Jack Leow. In the second Taylor fight JT was countering Pav everytime he tried to double the jab. In the BHop fight KP couldn't even make a single jab work consistently, and yet, we all heard Leow screaming "Double the ****ing jab," on both ocassions. In other words, Jack insisted on telling Kelly to do the very thing that wasn't working. In the BHop fight there were several times when if Pav woud have anticipated Hops movement, stepped left, and led with a hook, Hops would have ran right into it. Never once did I hear Jack say anything about the fact that Hops was moving almost exclusively to his own right. Jack Leow clearly needs help. Top Rank needs to find someone with whom Leow could build the kind of relationship we see with Nazim Richardson and John David Jackson. I have no idea who that would be, but I do think it is essential.
EXACTLY!! that's alll I've ever heard Leow say. I was thinking as I watched the damn thing. It obviously wasn't working. Pav needed some shorter shots on the inside and stay back a little and stop charging at B-Hop, which was exactly what Hops wanted.
Thanks for the nice summary. Of course some fighters start and finish with the same man in the corner, like Joe and Enzo Calzaghe. But as the firing of Graham did good to Hatton, I see the same here. I disagree with the Nazim/JDJ type of solution. It probably wouldn't work. Hopkins built up his Execution Squad when he was already a master boxer, JDJ, Richardson, Roach and Shilstone were more like advisors. For Pavlik, who's still a young fighter, it's either staying with the exact same team (I don't think it's good) or going to another direction, change of the head trainer is the minimum. It was the Hopkins fight where the mistakes turned out extremely visible, but former fights of Kelly showed that when he's not fighting his style of fight, he has problems. He's unable to adapt to his opponents, his defense has serious holes, no other top20 P4P pounder eats the same kind of shots in percentage as Pavlik. I didn't like his reaction when he was hurt vs. Taylor, he didn't know how to defend himself against serious amount of punches, and that was the case vs. Hopkins as well. Also, going to his left made Pavlik absolutely out of his rhythm and comfort zone, and he couldn't adapt to the new situation. IMHO the change of the head trainer is necessarily here. He can still do his stuff vs. the Rubio caliber of opponents, but many fighters out there can make the necessaily adjustments to bring Kelly out of his comfort zone, and that's it. I think these mistakes can be corrected by an experienced trainer.
A second problem with the partnership idea is the size of Leow's ego. The mother****er ain't even allowed in Rhode Island cuz he won't fit!!! Also, I take your point about BHop's dream team, but consider this. Pavlik is what he is. No trainer is going to turn Kelly into a slick boxer. However, a smart guy could polish him up around the edges more so than Leow has. Tighten up his defense, incorporate a little more lateral movement, more head movement, and a bit more punch variety. He does not need for someone to try and tear him down and rebuild him.
so who does everyone think pav should go with? maybe a few sparring sessions with bhop could do him some good???
That's the worst scenario. Doing some sparring and receiving advice from Hopkins how to do this and that, and then going back to do the old padwork with Loew would only confuse Kelly.