Philly Shell

I only know one fighter that uses it effectively. And I think if floyd wanted to use any style, he'd pull it off, down to sheer natural talent and genetics.

Who else uses it effectively mate? Don't say degale because defensively hes shocking so I wouldn't class him as using it effectively.

 

Floyd used the traditional upright high-guard stance as an ametuer. He uses the 'Philly Shell' cause he could use any stance he wants, and he'd be effective.

You have to have cat-like reflexes to pull it off.

 

Floyd can use it effectively because he's been practicing it every day for years. It's not about natural talent, it's about how hard the guy works.

 

Well yeah I guess it's just practise, lots ad lots of practise, twin that with the natural
Ability and reflexes and that's when it works. You'd have to e real comfortable with your lead hand down, quick to cover up when you're in danger but also pick them
Off when they step in too.

Boxinglad you can't say it's solely practise, if I practised and practised I would never get as good as floyd just through hard work. He's a natural athlete, born gifted, like Lionel messi. Sure training has got him where he wants to be, training in absolute abundance. But he was born with something that others don't have.

 

James Toney

 

Disagree.

 

It's a counter-punching style. And counter-punchers need quick reflexes. And the stance itself, with the lead hand low and the severe angle, requires you to roll, duck, slip, pull etc. in an instant.

If this wasn't a difficult stance/style, you would see more pros use it. I see guys try to switch to it in AM matches and tournements, and they get pummeled.

Why do you say you don't need quick reflexes?

 

I don't think it requires good reflexes if you have good anticipation and "ring IQ". Obviously good reflexes will be good for the style, but not a necessity.

 

Great ring generalship and IQ is a must. Reflexes are important, but not a necessity. I think the number one problem is that people that try the Philly Shell style out just don't have the Ring IQ to pull it off. I see alot of people get easily swarmed and pummeled when they revert to the Shell.

 

Yeah, I would say a sense of "feel" is the most important. Since you will be fighting in the pocket, feel and balance are critical.

James Toney is a prime example. I wouldnt say he has exceptional reflexes (good, but not exceptional), but his feel and balance are outstanding.

 

I think it is because most trainers don't understand it themselves, much less know how to teach it. Which is crazy because the basic foundation of boxing defense was to turn your body at an angle to your opponent, block the right hand with your left shoulder, and block everything else with the right glove or elbow. Keep the left hand free for counter punching. Then came Ali and the fundamentals of boxing defense were thrown out the window. Then Tyson and everybody stands square up.
Also, counter punching is looked at as a dirty thing any more; everybody seems to want to be a volume puncher.
The "philly shell" (after nearly 40 years hanging around gyms, etc...I've only recently heard this term. It used to be how you did it.)requires a lot of practice, to get you used to the punches flying around your head. Once your defense is instinctive, then you can start worrying about countering. Many young men are not that patient. If you recall, that style was something Toney grew into over the course of his career, and he was trained by Bill Miller, one of the best teachers ever.

 

[code]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81non05aKX4[/code]I don't think it's that effective, except for the obvious example. Winky Wright's style for example is much easier to use. Or if you really want a beautiful counterpunching style that balances offense/defense more evenly check out Charley Burley, a guy with a great shoulder roll, but much better foot work than Mayweather

 

When you know how to use it properly, it allows for quite a few mistakes, thats the whole point in the style as far as i can see.