Please rate Cleveland Williams?

That would be extraordinary. Especially if it was before fighting Liston. After fighting Liston Williams beat 13-10 Ernie Cab (a taxi driver) who Liston had already stopped on cuts and a lightheavyweight called Curley Lee who murdered his children. Neither of those guys were rated in 1959. Williams next fight was in 1960. Liston hammered Williams again that year and that was about all that happened to Williams until 1961 when he did begin to meet recognisable opposition. 1961 was the year people started to take Williams seriously.

 

Williams was actually rated by the NBA as early as 1957, following his ko win over John Holman. I can't find that link, but here's one from early '58:

https://news.google.com/newspapers?...AIBAJ&sjid=fEsDAAAAIBAJ&pg=6176,1214468&hl=en

 

Yet Holman was beaten five times over the previous 12 months of meeting Williams? Miteff, Pastrano, Eddie Machen, Baker and Nino Valdes all gave Holman terrific beatings that year.

 

Cab wasn't a great fighter but he was resilient.He had beaten Mike DeJohn and Sid Peaks


Charles (Sonny) Liston, 9th ranked heavyweight contender from Philadelphia, scored an eighth round technical knockout over surprisingly stubborn Ernie Cab of Brooklyn Tuesday night. Firing his best shots at Cab early in the scheduled 10 round fight with no apparent success, Liston resorted to a cutting left jab. He sliced Cab's left eye and the bridge of his nose in the second and kept battering away at the bloody target until the commission doctor ordered a halt at the end of the seventh." - Associated Press

Lee was 181.25lbs for the Williams fight had only lost one bout and had beaten decent Howard King in his previous fight Williams ruined Lee.

After the knockout loss, Lee started to have nosebleeds and severe headaches. It was discovered that he had a blood clot on the brain. He never fought again. In 1972, Lee drowned his four children and beat his brother-in-law to death with a crowbar. Psychiatrists testified that Lee suffered brain damage and "trauma-induced epilepsy" as a result of his boxing career. Superior Court Judge George Dell sentenced Lee to an indefinite term in a state hospital for the criminally insane. Dell said the insanity was due to "a vicious beating in the ring."
NB Lee was a substitute ,Liston was to have been Williams opponent in a rematch but got a training injury.

 

Holman had beaten
Satterfield
Mederos
Peaks
Turkey Thompson
Ezzard Charles
Cesar Brion
And ko'd Elmer Ray
Funny you seemed to have omitted those results.

 

Baker,Valdes ,and Pastrano beat Holman on points and the Baker fight was described as a dull one. There were no kds in any of the 3 fights.

Gilding The Lily?

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=eYtIAAAAIBAJ&sjid=AXYDAAAAIBAJ&pg=5503,4226669&hl=en

 

I like Holman. He punched hard and was thrown in out of his depth his whole career. Angelo Dundee won manager of the year with holman when he turned Holman from a loser into a winner. He had been knocked out hard four times before any of his good wins. Satterfeild and Embrell Davidson both flattened Holman. then once Dundee revived Holmans career with a couple of good wins over Charles and Brion Johnny was making waves ...But once Ezzard Charles beat him in a rematch things soon fizzled out. Dundee then fed holman to his other fighter Pastrano. This was after Baker and Machen had already put the kibosh on Holman as a leading star. when a guy loses hard five times in a row against name guys it’s all over. That’s when a fighter becomes the walking wounded. Machen pounded on him mercilessly. It was a bad, bad loss that one. “a vicious barrage of punches that ended the match in 38 seconds of the 7th. Holman crumpled into his own corner from a right hand and was counted out by referee Eddie Volk as he tried wobbily to get up." -Associated Press” Dundee must have known Johnny was ripe by then. After pastrano took what was left of holmans rating it was Valdes and Mittefs turn to slap Johnny around. Nino mauled him all night falling all over him. they both went over the top rope with Nino crushing Johnny on landing. An unedifying spectacle. Nino won clearly on points. Next up Miteff knocked poor Johnny spark out at the end of 9 physical rounds and the mauling from Williams was just weeks later.

 

Terrible events. Horrific matchmaking allowing an inept lightheavyweight to take on a 30lb heavier puncher like Williams as a late notice substitute.

 

But he wasn't "badly beaten" by either Valdes, Pastrano ,or Baker,as you stated.

 

But not Williams fault since he was scheduled to fight Liston! Therefore the implication that he delberately took a soft touch is erroneous.

 

Is that an acknowledgement he was rated as early as early 58? It's proven right there in his link.

 

Well it was just proven to you beyond a shadow of doubt Williams was ranked in early 58 so i dare say he was being taken seriously. I have also seen proof he was ranked in 59.

 

Curley Lee wasn't an "inept light heavyweight". He was the next best thing to undefeated, having avenged his one and only loss. The UPI saw his upcoming fight with Williams this way:

Curley Lee, the brash newcomer from Los Angeles, puts his fastmoving drive for a shot at the world heavyweight crown on the line tonight in a nationally televised match with dangerous Cleveland Williams.
The 210-pound Williams was a slight favorite going into tonight’s 10-round ABC-TV battle starting at 6pm PST, but some observers said this was only because the “big cat” was better known here than Lee.
Reports from the West Coast indicate the 22-year-old Lee is considered by some as the best sleeper bet to clout his way to a world heavyweight challenge.

 

Great work, you are all over this. It's quickly becoming obvious Williams was well respected as early as 57!

 

He was soundly beaten by Valdes. Johnny was punished and mauled all the way through. Including the unedifying bundling over the top rope and 220lb of Cuban crashing down on top of him from a great height. Nino was rough. Miteff and Machen both sparked him. Those were career shortening trauma each of them. His fith and sixth knockout defeats. Pastrano and Baker no doubt gave him a severe boxing lesson.