Poll - Who would win? Sonny Liston 1959 or Oleksandr Usyk 2022?

This guy has a notorious agenda against Liston... no use trying to reason with him.

 

Of course. I see your point but the OP specified so i put my 2 cents.

 

Liston has an extremely underwhelming resume. Who did Liston beat that Usyk wouldn't beat?

 

I get why folks favor Liston. I love the guy as a fighter but there is something that that is being overlooked that would be a bigger issue than most of you think.

Liston's entire offense is set up off of the jab. Liston never faced and elite southpaw in his career and against Uysk he would have to land that jab against a guy who has made his bread and butter taking away that punch from conventional fighters. That right lefty matchup is very significant especially when the conventional fighter's offense comes off of they jab.

Liston, Holmes and Lewis were all guys that had excellent jabs as more or less there primary weapon. Non of them lined up to fight Southpaws for this reason.

 

Cleveland I think potentially could have Usyk in hell................Floyd, Machen and Zora Folley would be tough fights for Usyk IMHO although they are smaller (LHW/CW dimensions), I still think they would be rough fights. There's no way I would just say Usyk runs those guys over .

original question:
Sonny was bigger, stronger, a hammering hitter, really a great chin as well, and we see what Usyk's power at HW and CW is (good but not dangerzone power). One of the greatest HW jabs ever. I think he beats Usyk, there's really no size advantage there. Usyk is taller than most Liston opponents, but again height is less of a factor than size and there isn't a real size deficit.

I'd say given everything this is a 50/50 fight but I'd take Liston.

 

“Winner by knockout at 2:17 of the sixth round, Charles ‘Sonny’ Liston.”

 

There were very very few southpaws in Liston's era. He fought one of them off the top of my head post-Ali, Gerhard Zech and beat him handily.
The only other southpaw around was Mildenberger, and Liston tried to get a fight with him but Mildenberger declined (high risk, no reward.... nobody would touch Liston after the Maine fiasco).
There is literally zero basis for your claim that he avoided southpaws.

 

I never said he avoided them. I said they didn't line up to face them which is true to an extent. I agree there simply wasn't a lot of southpaws in Listons era but the point is really that there is a stylistic issue from a matchup perspective. Anyone that ever boxed would agree that landing jabs against a southpaw is different from a conventional fighter. The lead hands are in direct conflict. Does that make sense? Uysk gas made a career out of limited the effectiveness of the jab from a conventional fighter.

 

No it's not true to an extent, in Liston's case at least. Their were TWO noteworthy southpaws. He fought ONE and beat him handily despite, being significantly past prime and close to if not in his 40s, and tried to get a fight with another one, who declined to fight him. What else was Liston supposed to do? Hold him at gunpoint?

 

Your are missing the point. Liston faced no one like Uysk. I'm not saying he couldn't find a way to win. I'm saying that his primary weapon would not be as affective against a guy like Uysk who who has spent his life matched with conventional fighter's. We are talking hundreds of amateur and pro fights. It would definitely be an issue for Liston to overcome.

 

YOU are missing the point. You stated "Liston, Holmes and Lewis were all guys that had excellent jabs as more or less there primary weapon. Non of them lined up to fight Southpaws for this reason." That is simply not true in Liston's case. He went out of his way to pursue the only two southpaws worth a damn in his era.

 

I’m a huge Liston fan, he’s my favourite heavyweight of all time but realistically this is a stylistic disaster for him and he probably doesn’t get near Usyk, he only faced one elite mover in Ali and we saw what happened in the first fight. As usual here though nostalgia is taking over logic. I still don’t think most boxing fans actually realise how good Usyk is and won’t do until after he’s retired, I fully expect him to whoop fury and I believe he would’ve whooped most of peoples favourite heavyweights of the past

 

Sorry your juvenile rant primarily consisting of middle school insults got deleted.

 

Yeah, I probably went to far. I do that from time to time. After all, I am a fighter and carry myself as such. I guess we should just go our separate ways.

 

All good mate, I’m not perfect myself. Not by a long shot

No hard feelings mate. You clearly have passion for the sport which is why we’re all here right?