Popular Opinion Time

I think that a lot of people overstate the whole "styles make fights" axiom (including myself), and so many times overstated subjects often turn out to be untrue, and a lot of people believe this to be the case as well, but it is not.

 

Tyson-Ali
Tyson-Foreman
are the most commonly believed and wrong “styles make fights” arguments with Frazier being used for comparison.

 

Lemme guess. You really think Tyson would win both of these matchups?

 

Yeah. Tyson and Frazier had strengths and weaknesses that differed so much with eachother that the comparison is overused. I would Pick Tyson over Foreman but not Ali, Frazier had a better style to beat Ali and Tyson had a better style to beat Foreman

 

Excuse me? First don’t talk like a douche. Secondly it was more to say that most use Frazier as a middle man for the outcomes whether Tyson wins or not in either encounter would have to be based on something other then the troubles Ali had with Joe or the ease Foreman smashed Joe.

 

Tyson would have to run for 5 rounds to make it. And I've never seen Mike run for 5 rounds as long as I've watched him.

 

I was just being a snarky little gobshite lol. I agree w/ you. Frazier and Tyson should not be compared. You're entirely correct.

 

A prime Foreman was too defensively wide open to survive the Tyson onslaught, Tyson was more accurate, much faster and had a better chin. If the fight ends early believe me it’s likely to be George on the canvas

 

Ok. So Tyson and Foreman both start fast, they'll each be throwing bombs in the first round. If George is more powerful, tougher, and bigger, how come Tyson comes out the victor in these early round exchanges. I personally think the only way Tyson could beat Foreman is to run away from him and get him to tire out and then KO him.

 

Because of the Speed advantage and the fact Tyson had an underrated and pretty iron chin. Foreman definitely had advantages over Mike, but I struggle to see how he survives the inevitable Tyson onslaught, if Lyle can have him that hurt, Mike will finish the job, the hand speed would be the difference

 

True, he does have speed on his side, but how does he reach Foreman. I mean, it's a long way to the top. I don't believe that Tyson had an iron chin though. He was never knocked out by any big punchers, aside from Lewis. That's not to say he couldn't take a punch though.
Foreman was probably a bit ring rusty against Lyle, but being hurt that badly isn't a sign of a bad chin. The fact that George was dumped on his face by Lyle, got up and stopped him is proof of a great chin. Can you see Mike doing that? He couldn't even take a body shot from Evander without going down.

 

That is correct.

The only 2 scenarios in which Tyson could beat a prime Foreman are:

-dash out of his corner as soon as the bell rings and throw everything but the kitchen sink at Foreman as soon as the match starts, landing combinations upstairs and downstairs relentlessly with 100% perfect defense and head movement to avoid getting clobbered and pray to God he can KO Foreman or at least drop him/rock him badly early and convince the ref to wave it off or get a corner stoppage within 5 rounds.

-Change his entire style and use hit and run tactics, weaving in and out. Or use lateral movement.

Both are very unlikely--the 1st one being a huge unwise gamble and the 2nd one being borderline impossible. In the first scenario, that would be a massive risk because A) charging toward Foreman aggressively never ended well for anyone, B) Foreman had a granite chin and C) in spite of the gap in speed, Tyson would inevitably leave himself open at some point if he gets right in Foreman's face and a single shot from Foreman could turn the momentum around. Not only that, even if for the sake of argument Tyson can hurt Foreman early, if he cannot finish him or force a stoppage, such an aggressive early start will drain Tyson of his own gas tank rapidly and he will be a sitting duck if it doesn't work out.

For the 2nd scenario, Foreman had much longer legs and knew how to cut the ring off so a half-assed adjustment from the stocky 5'10 Tyson attempting to fight backing up or using lateral movement for the 1st time in his career probably wouldn't end well. It's also hard to envision a guy with a 71' reach keeping Foreman off of him with a jab.

He is not beating Foreman in a slug fest or a long drawn out war in any universe.

And then there's the mental aspect, I'm not sure if Tyson would win that stare down and psychological warfare if they met. Foreman's brother recalls a time when he had dropped an opponent with a vicious shot and the opponent looked up at Foreman shouting "are you trying to kill me man...?!?" and Foreman simply nodded while maintaining eye contact. He was a different sort of beast back then and a lot of Tyson's confidence was built up from Cus, Teddy, and Rooney hyping him up.

 

OMG Cobra. I'm amazed at how you can put together these ingenious arguments in just a couple of minutes. Unbelievable.

 

Let's hear a round of applause for this man.