Pound-for-Pound, Manny Pacquiao is the greatest fighter since Pernell Whitaker.

I'm really going to take this post to bits, as it's really ****. Even for Danny R, it's really ****.

atsch - A prime Barrera and a prime Marquez are both clearly better wins than a Bernard Hopkins who had only ever been the 12 round distance once in his young career.

atsch - What the **** does this have to do with the quality of the win? William Joppy beat Roberto Duran, and Duran achieved more in his career than Hopkins and Toney put together, so does that mean Joppy's win over Duran is better than Jones's win over Toney? ****ing moronic non-sensical point.

atsch - If you are only going by the name (which you seem to be by going on about career accomplishments, then Manny beat Oscar, and Oscar achieved more in his career than James Toney. But in reality, Jones's win over Toney is a much better win than Manny's over Oscar IMO. That's because you don't go by the name only, you should be going on the quality of the opponent at the time.

I would agree with you if Jones had beaten a top class heavy. He didn't. He beat John Ruiz. And Toney beat Ruiz not long after. John Ruiz was never a good heavyweight never mind a great one. Jones's win is great on paper, but it was not a great win.

atsch - Flyweight to welterweight baby!

atsch - As usual, the opposite of what you think is true. It is far far more impressive for a smaller man to jump 40lbs than a bigger man. At heavyweight, it is an everyday occurrence that a 220lbs man fights a 240lbs man. That's a perfectly standard size disparity between two heavys, because size means less as you go up. Try putting a 120lbs man in with a 140lbs man - and you'd see a horrible mismatch and early execution.

That I even have to explain this to you is absurd, considering you have been a member of a boxing forum for a long time. This is something that an absolute novice fan would pick up right away. What in hell goes on in your twisted mind??

atsch - John Ruiz has a KO punch??

David Diaz was a WBC champion before Pac fought him. He wasn't a policeman. Let's be fair, there are worse names on both mens' resumes than David Diaz.

Hatton was p4p#5 back in '07. He was the consensus world number 1 at light-welterweight when Pacquiao fought him. Other than Hopkins & Toney (which are easily outnumbered by Pac's wins over HOF comp), how many people did Roy beat that were as good as Ricky? There were not many. You could argue Tarver and Hill. That's all. Hatton achieved more than Griffin, and that seems to be your main criteria, so that rules Griffin out. McCallum was well past-prime when Jones beat him in a meaningless mismatch. Roy's resume just doesn't have the depth.

I consider Toney an ATG, but many don't. I think most would consider Oscar greater p4p. There is a very valid argument that Barrera and Morales are greater than Toney too.

Hopkins is an ATG, but he wasn't when Roy fought him. Roy beating Bernard in 1993 does not mean anything like as much as if Roy had beat him in 2001. And it certainly doesn't mean as much as Pacquiao beating Barrera in 2003 or Marquez in 2008, when Barrera and Marquez were already established as two of the very best in the world.

Hmmm. McCallum is an HOFer for sure, but he was years and years past his prime and past his peak weight division when Roy fought him.

Who else that Roy fought will make the HOF?

Tarver? Maybe. Hill? Maybe.

Does 1 definite and 2 maybe's qualify as a "host"? Nah.

Yes, you are. You spit hatred when anyone criticizes Floyd, you often express hate when discussing Pacquiao.

Pac never made it look as easy because he was fighting harder opposition.

Again though I ask, is making relatively easy fights look incredibly easy really the most important factor in deciding who is the better fighter pound-for-pound?

Are resume (number of fights against top quality opponents) and achievements not far more important?

Pac has the edge now. You are in the minority, and will be further marginalized as time goes on.

You should let go of the hate and open your heart to the ATG Pacman! :good

 

But Pea was still the better fighter. You can keep breaking it down into categories, but Pea was better. End of story.

atsch What do you think putting people to the sword means '****? Whitaker dominated some very good opponents h2h. He didn't always settle for a classy UD, sometimes he stopped or really punished good comp (like Haugen) or very good comp (like McGirt).

But you would need to have actually seen these fights to know that.

 

Yeah, let's put it to bed since you are losing it and look like a chump.

Pac in his prime (arguable) lost to Morales in the best win of Morales's career, then dismantled him twice.

Roy's only close fight (till he got KTFO by Tarver and Johnson) was with a vastly inferior fighter to Morales in Montell Griffin.

But Roy is better because he never lost in his prime and Pac did.

So by Danny's logic, Roy is also greater pound-for-pound than:


RAY ROBINSON (who had a prime loss to Randy Turpin... which he avenged, much like Pac did with Morales!)

ROBERTO DURAN (who had a prime loss to Esteban deJesus... which he avenged, much like Pac did with Morales!)

PERNELL WHITAKER (who had a prime "loss" to Jose Luis Ramirez... which he avenged, much like Pac did with Morales!)



Great point as ever Danny Boy!!

 

:nut I see you know almost as much about mathematics as you do about boxing.

Pac won his first world title at FLY not bantam you chump, weight: 112lbs. He has won two fights at welter, and holds the WBO welter title: 147lbs.

Weight jump: 35lbs between the divisions.

Jones win his first world title at middle, weight 160lbs. When he fought at heavyweight, heavy was anything over 190lbs, and Jones weighed 193.

Weight jump: 30lbs between the divisions.

You have FAILED to subtract 160 from 190, and you have FAILED to identify that Pac jumped more weight. :good

Yes, but I have already explained why this opinion is a non-sensical piece of **** that a child could recognize.

Weight difference matters far less as you go up, that's why a 210lbs man is permitted to face a 260lbs man, whereas a 110lbs would NEVER EVER be permitted to face a 160lbs man.

 

:fire

OK, now I'm actually getting pissed off because you are actually doing one of my all-time favourite fighters, James Toney, a disservice with your continually exposed lack of boxing knowledge.

Toney has a strong resume by contemporary standards, but you never pick out the Holyfield win if you are going to name a win of JT's that trumps any win of someone else.

Have you actually seen these fights:

- Nunn
- Jirov
- McCallum I (scored as a draw, was it ****, one of the best mw performances of the last 20 years from Toney, clear win)

Mention any of them, chump. Those three wins are in a different stratosphere to a win over a shot Holyfield.


These are Barrera's wins which were clearly better than Toney's over Holyfield:

Morales II, Morales III, Hamed, McKinney, Paulie Ayala


Here are Morales's wins which were clearly better:

Barrera I, Pacquiao I, Zaragoza, J.Jones, Chi, Ayala, Chavez

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On this thread you have been thoroughly...

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By the way Danny_Raped, you replied to every single one of my posts until this one:

DON'T REPLY TO ANY OF MY OTHERS UNTIL YOU HAVE REPLIED TO THIS ONE.

I'm waiting.