Povetkin: Stiverne wanted a way out....

Pass/fail -- use whatever word you like, he had an "adverse result" in his test for meldonium before the Wilder fight was cancelled. He passed several tests -- which is to say the tests detected zero meldonium in his system -- and then, suddenly, out of the blue, it shows up on the fourth test.

Odd? How did it get there if it wasn't there before? The B sample also tested positive. Now how did that happen?

The WBC's ruling on that was NOT that he was "cleared" or that he passed the test.

The WBC's ruling in that case said that:

1) They couldn't "scientifically prove" when he took the meldonium. The question wasn't whether the amount was "allowable," it was that it showed up in a "positive" best after previously not showing up -- creating the logical conclusion that it was introduced after the September cutoff date for taking meldonium.

Understand this: WADA, VADA, the WBC nor the CIA, FBI or NAACP ever said, "You can continue to make meldonium as long as you don't take it past this level of dosage." There was a cutoff date beyond which is is a banned substance if you take it.

The questions were "how long does it stay in the system?" And "How the heck is it in his system in Test 4 but not in Test 1, 2 or 3?

Also go back and look how long it took to get the Russians (Povetkin/Ryabinski) to agree to ANY testing -- Ryabainski wanted it to be an unnamed "European lab" rather than a certified drug testing agency. And the WBC had to MANDATE that it be VADA so they had no choice but to agree to it.

All of this has been reported. As has the curious fact that Povetkin took a trip to Spain during training -- not exactly a boxing training hotbed, but to a place known for cutting-edge doping. And this for a guy who almost NEVER leaves Russia.

Curious, at the very least.

But back to the WBC's ruling on the meldonium situation:

2) The WBC also ruled that Povetkin had to subject himself to a high frequency of testing for one year at his own expense. Find me a case of a false positive or a fighter (or any athlete) who was "cleared of wrongdoing" who ever was ordered to have extra testing at their own expense for a year.

3) The WBC ruled that if Povetkin tests positive for a banned substance within that year (as he just did), that the WBC will not allow him to take place in a WBC-sanctioned event for an indefinite period (as well as losing his ranking, etc.).

So the "curious" or "suspicious" way that the WBC "handled this" is EXACTLY WHAT THEY SAID THEY WOULD DO, and told Povetkin they would do, IN WRITING, AHEAD OF TIME. He tested positive going into this fight for a different banned substance and they refused to sanction the fight.

How is that handling this improperly?

4) Furthermore, the WBC also ruled that if any evidence emerges from the Wilder/DiBella/Ryabinski/Povetkin lawsuits that Povetkin had, indeed, taken meldonium after the September 2015 cutoff date, that the WBC would rule retroactively as a failed test and ban/sanction/strip of titles/ranking.

That's a whole lot of stuff to determine based on what you say is a non-failed drug test.

If the WBC and VADA looked at the meldonium situation and said, "OK, we made a mistake, he's allowed to take that," why would they put all of that stuff on Povetkin? Why would he be subject to further testing? Why would they tell him that if he failed YET ANOTHER test that the punishment would not be as if it were a first failed best, but rather indefinite suspension, loss of ranking, etc.?

Why would Povetkin cheat? To gain an advantage, same as any PED cheat. Maybe he was microdosing and got caught. Maybe he was taking Bane levels of toxic PED sludge pumped into him continuously and the effort to mask it failed.

Even his side's early spin seems to indicate that they aren't going to try to say he didn't have a banned substance in his system -- Povetkin's postfight comments were "I don't know how that got in my body" and Ryabinski said "Well, maybe it somehow got into his system by accident."

Yeah, real plausible.

You know what cheaters do? They cheat. And sometimes they get caught. He's been caught twice this year.

 

An adverse result that could not be proven to as when it was taken. By a drug that has not been proven to give any benefits.

Innocent until proven guilty. He would walk in a court of law for the Meldonium. WBC new it that's why he wasn't suspended like other people are that test positive. You may not like the result but you are wrong.

This new case he is probably guilty. And should be punished after a proper investigation.

 

1)well i hope you never get breathalised by the police and test 17 times under the allowed limit ,because by your logic you will end up in court over it for 'adverse results'

you also have no idea how meldonium is metabolised and if you read up on it you could understand how you can test clean then test for trace amounts, but this is just another glaring example of low information boxing fans roaring about peds when they have no idea whats going on. Il explain it to you so you don't make the mistake in the future, meldonium can bind to fat cell and take stay in your system for up to 8 years, you might not test for it but you could then exercise use up fat, the meldonium is then realesed into the blood stream and turns up in the test

the wbc ruling means nothing, he was under the allowed limit, they took 6 months to come to the decision ,because it looked like they wanted to protect wilder, the issue was a non issue and could have been sorted out in 5 seconds if they looked up their own rule book and realised he broke no rules. Instead they treated him unfairly

2). That just shows how unfair the wbc have been in the whole povetkin issue, he does nothing wrong gets stripped of he's mandatory and has to pay for extra testing. It looks like an attempt by the wbc to make povetkin say screw you and go with someother sanctioning body if you ask me and shows how badly he was treated.

3) that ruling again is complete bs, he shouldn't be treated any different to any other fighter considering he broke no rules, stiverne was allowed test dirty and continue, the wbc again havn't even investigated this at all and rushed to judgement, another example of the bias and corruption of the wbc

4) the forth point makes no sense because the wbc know full well their is no info that could change that or else they would have used it the first time round.

Also all these WBC rulings mean nothing, they are an organisation, not the law, if what they say goes against what actually happened then they don't have a leg to stand on


they put all the other stuff on povetkin to put him at a further disadvantage and keep him as far away from wilder as possible, povetkin shouldn't have had to fight stiverne to keep he's mandatory, and you seem to love the corruption of the wbc when it suits you and your fighter, which is exactly the attitude that is crippling boxing. Fans supporting and defending corruption when it suits them

you continue to push your false narrative, not twice a year, once a year and even that hasn't been looked into

 

Thanks for giving the informed and nuanced reply to this fan boy. I didn't have the time. He's been on here for a year defending Wilder to the point you would think he was haymon's paid PR man.
He'll have you believe Wilder's heavyweight defenses are against top opposition. That Wilder should be a p4p threat and so on. Long rambling messages of legal jargon when bottom line was the WBC didn't suspend Povetkin because they couldn't prove when he took meldonium (which was likely banned for political reasons) and his limits were acceptable by their own rules.
WBC = we be crooks

 

Read this: https://www.wada-ama.org/sites/default/files/resources/files/wada-2016-04-12-meldonium-notice-en.pdf

It says, per WADA:

1) Meldonium is on the banned substance list as of Jan. 1, 2016

2) Meldonium meets the criteria of being on the banned list (which means the experts believe it is performance-enhancing)

3) The mere existence of meldonium in an athlete's system after Jan. 1, 2016, constitutes an anti-doping rule violation

4) It doesn't say ANYWHERE that you can take meldonium after Jan. 1, 2016, at ANY LEVEL. It's not, 'You can take a little bit, but not too much.' It's banned. Period.

5) The question is about how long it stays in the system. You will note the words "any test taken before March 1, 2016" in discussing how it can stay in the system.

Povetkin's failed test was after March 1.

It also says research is ongoing and they intend to find the length of time that the substance can linger in the system, and upon finding that limit they can and will go back and nail those who still had it in their system past that time limit.

So the case isn't over, for Povetkin or anyone else caught with meldonium.

But I challenge you to answer these questions:

1) How is it that a test found meldonium in his system AFTER previous tests did not? How does it magically appear in his body after it wasn't there without him actually introducing it into his body?

2) Why does a world-class athlete take a medication that is for heart ailments if he has no heart ailment?

3) Why do all these Russian athletes take this substance? Are they all heart patients? If it has no beneficial effect, why is it so widespread?

 

You do realize that the A and B sample is taken at the same time?

Also Reading your post, wich you hold against Povetkin, would in someone elses eyes look like the WBC is acting really dodgy from a sample that couldnt be confirmed as doping.

Why doesnt all that apply for other boxers? ex Stiverne. He also admitted consuming a banned substance, that was banned during the time of ingestion, but got a way very cheap.

 

it will be the only reply, some people are beyond common sense. I treat everyone with the same standards, if an american got screwed like this id do the same thing

 

lmao big long post but doesn't post the most important fact

wada said 1mg of meldonium was allowed after march for the year, povetkin tested 17 times under the level. boom stop being bias and leaving out the most important fact which renders your long reply useless.

 

Exactly. Leaves out the most important fact. Why wasn't Povetkin suspended big long winded reply about nothing.
I'm American and I know things look very fishy right now by the WBC

 

Please link the scientific study that shows meldonium stays in the body for up to 8 years. Find me one published scientific study that tracks tests for meldonium for 8 years.

None exists. That's why WADA is doing ongoing studies to establish exactly how long it can linger.

The allowable limit that an athlete can take after Jan. 1, 2016, is ZERO. WADA says "the mere presence" of it in the system constitutes an anti-doping violation. You're the one spewing falsehoods.

Read this: https://www.wada-ama.org/sites/default/files/resources/files/wada-2016-04-12-meldonium-notice-en.pdf

Show me where in there it says an athlete can take even 1/1,000000000000th of a nanogram of meldonium after Jan. 1, 2016, as an "allowable limit."

Your boy got caught taking one PED but found a loophole. Won't be so lucky this time.

And to further correct you, Povetkin didn't have to fight Stiverne to keep his position as mandatory contender. Because Wilder got injured and was on the shelf, the WBC sanctioned a fight between Povetkin and Stiverne for the interim belt. Sasha's people wanted that fight to put a belt on him -- they bid for the right to promote it and won.

Then he failed a drug test -- AGAIN -- and now he's further proven to be the drug cheat that he has been all along.

 

its not just the wbc, im losing faith in wada too. Also while in think vada do the best testing ,they are a private american company, which means they can be easily corrupted and have no mandate to govern world boxingg at all.

boxing needs a reformation

 

wada came out after this and said 1mg for the whole of 2016 was acceptable

stop lying, leaving out facts and spreading misinformation, you have obviously looked this stuff up so you know full well you are spreading lies and leaving out the most important imformation which makes your argument useless

 

Very interesting and plausible. Boxing does need reformation.

 

If I'm lying, you can easily prove it.

Just show me a link to anything by WADA that says taking ANY AMOUNT ABOVE ZERO after Jan. 1, 2016, is allowable.

You cannot, because the amount allowable to be ingested by needle, powder, liquid, gas or any other method is ABSOLUTELY NONE after Jan. 1, 2016.

It is on the prohibited list as of that date.

And I'm also still waiting for a link to a study that says it can stay in the system up to 8 years.

Look, I understand your boy got popped for a banned substance AGAIN and that upsets you and shakes your worldview. But he did. And that doesn't change that everything I posted is an absolute FACT. You cannot dispute any word of it, nor have you.

I read this stuff from WADA and elsewhere when the whole thing came up in the spring. It's easy to find. But I made it even easier by providing a link.

So quit making stuff up about 8-year studies (that you inexplicably can't link) and that WADA supposedly said at some point that you can take meldonium after Jan. 1, 2016, because THEY NEVER DID. If so, just provide a link.

No, you've read some misinformation on message boards and took it as fact because it fit your narrative. But read what WADA says rather than what someone said on a forum. You don't have to take my word, because I provided an indisputable link.

 

SaintPat,
You might know a WHOLE LOT about boxing, and the history of the sport, and the fighters, their resumes, their attributes, their past times, etc etc etc....

But...YDKSA human physiology.

Let me teach you something so you can contribute to the next debate.

Kidney's filter water, minerals, and toxins out of the blood stream and then send the waste to the bladder where it is stored until such time as we find a commode, a tree, a cup, or Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump. When we reach a commode, a tree, a cup or Hillary/Donald, we **** in or on them.

Our ****....urine, is almost always 99.99% water. That .01% is the toxins, minerals, sugars, etc that our bodies expel.
The weight of the non-water part of our urine is called "specific gravity". It's a measure of weight of the non water part of our urine, and usually an indicator of hydration and kidney function.

When we wake in the am, and Hillary or Donald aint around, we aint in the woods, we find a commode. At this time, we are normally at our highest specific gravity.
That said, if that measure is taken after a 12 rd fight, it would likely be considerably higher, that is unless we did a 12 rd waltz aka Wlad/Fury.
But.....during the months leading up to a fight, fighters, if theyre trying to hide something, could say, drink 3-4 gallons of cranberry juice, perfectly legal, clearing toxins out of their kidneys faster than the kidneys can filter them from the blood. In some COURT ORDERED urine screens, a person may be made to retake the test since the spec gravity was too low to measure for toxins.
In sport, no such enforcement can be made since athletes are not guilty til proven innocent unlike criminals who are guilty and therefore under higher suspicion.
If Potvetkin was maintaining good hydration for say his first 3-4 tests, the "legal" trace amount of meldonium would not have shown up since his kidneys were filtering it out adequately.
On the 1 wk test, when he was busted, he very well may have had an excessively draining sparring session, and sweated out so much water that his specific gravity was notably higher than the previous tests.
His kidneys then filtered a larger amount of the meldonium from his blood b/c there was less water to pass.

If you ever take a drug screen for a job and are smoking grass, dont buy that fake urine or the wizzinator, just drink a couple gallons of cranberry juice, a liter of H2O and **** about 3/4 X before the test. Your kidney won't be able to filter enough of the THC from your blood, and you'll essentially be giving the tester a cup full of light water.