Prime Artur Beterbiev vs 35 year old Larry Holmes

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by ShortRound, Jun 19, 2022.


Who takes it?

Poll closed Jun 26, 2022.

  1. Beterbiev

    13 vote(s)
    23.2%

  2. Holmes

    43 vote(s)
    76.8%
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  1. FrankinDallas

    FrankinDallas FRANKINAUSTIN

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    This new guy is a troll. Don't bother with him.
     
    FrankinDallas, Jun 19, 2022
    FrankinDallas, Jun 19, 2022
    #31
    Loudon likes this.
  2. Loudon

    Loudon Loyal Member Full Member

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    1. Michael Spinks proved himself to be a credible HW, with a win over Cooney, and 2 extremely close fights with Holmes.

    2. Holmes lost officially, but the decisions were extremely controversial.

    3. As a professional, Beterbiev has only had 18 fights at LHW, where there’s zero proof that he could become a credible HW.

    4. Michael spinks was taller, faster and possessed a bigger reach.

    5. Michael Spinks had a style better suited to HW.

    6. There has been no gradual progression in the sport.

    7. Moorer was also proven as a HW with more height and reach, and better movement.

    8. None of your posts contain any context.


    Larry Holmes would have been a significant favourite over last nights Beterbiev.

    Beterbiev hasn’t got the style, size or speed to be given a serious chance to beat Larry.

    Larry had a great jab, a great chin, great technical skills, and possessed height, reach and weight advantages over Beterbiev.

    You also don’t know what Beterbiev would look like as a pro HW, and how the extra weight would affect him.

    Come back to us if/when Beterbiev ever fights pro as a CW-HW.

    Troubling Usyk in 3 round amateur fights isn’t enough to predict that he’d have had a decent chance of beating even a 35 year old Holmes.


    Larry Holmes was still a top 10 HW in the early 90’s, when he was in his 40’s.

    He beat very good HW’s like Ray Mercer.


    Yes, theoretically, Beterbiev could move up to HW. But until he does, even a past prime Holmes would be greatly favoured.
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2022
    Loudon, Jun 19, 2022
    Loudon, Jun 19, 2022
    #32
    BitPlayerVesti and MarkusFlorez99 like this.
  3. Loudon

    Loudon Loyal Member Full Member

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    Beterbiev would be too small at HW due to his STYLE.

    Mike was small, but had incredible hand and foot speed, with great upper body and head movement, along with explosive power.

    It wouldn’t matter if Beterbiev and Mike weighed the same.

    Mike is small and explosive, whereas Beterbiev is small and slow.

    Holmes couldn’t jab Mike.

    Holmes would EASILY have jabbed Beterbiev.

    They were 2 completely different fighters.

    They would have been 2 completely different stylistic match ups.
     
    Loudon, Jun 19, 2022
    Loudon, Jun 19, 2022
    #33
  4. Themessiah

    Themessiah El Jefe Full Member

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    He's not even new, its actually NEETzchean, new account with the same writing style and opinions
     
    Themessiah, Jun 19, 2022
    Themessiah, Jun 19, 2022
    #34
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  5. Loudon

    Loudon Loyal Member Full Member

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    Beterbiev has a THREE round AMATEUR decision over an AMATEUR Usyk.

    That’s your evidence that Beterbiev would have beaten Holmes at HW?

    Ha!

    GTFO.

    Frankin’s right.

    You gotta be trolling for a joke.
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2022
    Loudon, Jun 19, 2022
    Loudon, Jun 19, 2022
    #35
  6. Loudon

    Loudon Loyal Member Full Member

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    All of which means that what happened in the amateurs can’t be used as realistic evidence of what would happen in the pros.

    Mike Tyson couldn’t make the 84 Olympics.
     
    Loudon, Jun 19, 2022
    Loudon, Jun 19, 2022
    #36
  7. Loudon

    Loudon Loyal Member Full Member

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    Dear Lord.

    His jab didn’t work against Mike’s UNIQUE STYLE and MOVEMENT.

    Beterbiev is there to be hit with a jab.

    He isn’t fast or explosive.

    He’s static in comparison to Mike.

    Easier to hit, with little head movement.
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2022
    Loudon, Jun 19, 2022
    Loudon, Jun 19, 2022
    #37
  8. Loudon

    Loudon Loyal Member Full Member

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    Mar 7, 2012
    No, no, no!

    Don’t you dare do this to us!

    Ha!

    Are you sure that it’s him?
     
    Loudon, Jun 19, 2022
    Loudon, Jun 19, 2022
    #38
  9. Themessiah

    Themessiah El Jefe Full Member

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    Yh its him, he was banned not too long ago lol and probably made a new account instantly
     
    Themessiah, Jun 19, 2022
    Themessiah, Jun 19, 2022
    #39
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  10. chacal

    chacal F*** the new normal Full Member

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    or it might be you.
     
    chacal, Jun 19, 2022
    chacal, Jun 19, 2022
    #40
    Loudon likes this.
  11. Loudon

    Loudon Loyal Member Full Member

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    Ha!

    It’s all making sense now.
     
    Loudon, Jun 19, 2022
    Loudon, Jun 19, 2022
    #41
  12. ShortRound

    ShortRound Active Member banned Full Member

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    "Mike was the ONLY guy to ever knock out Holmes in a 75 fight career which spanned 20 years."

    Nick Wells (future professional nonentity) KO'd Holmes twice in the amateurs. Holmes was also knocked down three times in the pros pre-Tyson by men ranging from 188-216 lbs who didn't have nearly Beterbiev's skills or athleticism. Had he faced more big punchers with elite finishing ability, he'd have got KO'd more.

    "Beterbiev doesn’t possess Mike’s power, speed or style"

    We don't have the means to gauge speed or power objectively, we have to look at their performances against various opponents. Usyk fought at HW in the amateurs and not only was Beterbiev fast enough to stay on him and land plenty, Usyk stated that Beterbiev was his toughest opponent and punched "very hard", even compared to the 200 pounders he faced in dozens of amateur bouts. Beterbiev and Tyson are both pressure fighters (although Beterbiev has more tools in his arsenal) and a 38 year old Holmes crumbled under the pressure of the smaller, faster man. Beterbiev may take longer, maybe a lot longer to get the job done but it's perfectly feasible, especially if he came in 200+ lbs at HW, where there is no draining yourself to make weight.

    "A less experienced pressure fighter?"

    Beterbiev had 300 amateur bouts, Tyson had 27. Tyson was 21 years old when he fought Holmes, Beterbiev was 28 when he made his transition to the pros. Tyson started boxing age 12/13, Beterbiev 10/11. So clearly Tyson is a vastly less experienced pressure fighter than a prime Beterbiev.
     
    ShortRound, Jun 19, 2022
    ShortRound, Jun 19, 2022
    #42
  13. ShortRound

    ShortRound Active Member banned Full Member

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    "First minute of the fight last night Smith was in fact jabbing Beterbiev very well"

    Smith lands 3/19 jabs in a round he gets dropped twice (one given) is nuked in the next (landing only one more jab in 14 attempts, so a precipitous decline in accuracy) and that's your example of an effective jab against Beterbiev? Dear dear dear
     
    ShortRound, Jun 19, 2022
    ShortRound, Jun 19, 2022
    #43
  14. ShortRound

    ShortRound Active Member banned Full Member

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    No, the trilogy as a whole is strong evidence, against a fighter who was about to school or destroy everyone in the 2013 WSB. The amateur format didn't even favour Beterbiev as it reduces the importance of factors like power, durability and stamina.
     
    ShortRound, Jun 19, 2022
    ShortRound, Jun 19, 2022
    #44
  15. ShortRound

    ShortRound Active Member banned Full Member

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    LHW Spinks beat Holmes with his attributes but it's absurd to think he's the ONLY LHW or that's the only style that could be effective against a 35 year old Holmes.

    Another moron who repeats the false narrative that Beterbiev is a slow caveman with no movement and...no explosiveness??? If Beterbiev is easy to hit with a jab it's very strange that no one has had much success against him with it, Gvozdyk included.
     
    ShortRound, Jun 19, 2022
    ShortRound, Jun 19, 2022
    #45
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