Prime Charles vs Prime Liston

peak liston did not knock evryone out. charles would have to be as bad as evryone liston crushed to be confident on that statement. liston never beat anyone as good as charles.

 

fair point, charles did lose first time to elmer ray who was as close to liston as there was at that time. it was disputed however and charles nearly killed him in the rematch. I think if you get a much much beter liston against a much much beter lotis martin you get charles.

 

Something about this statement grates on me. Yes, i find it grossly unfair to Liston actually. You're taking an old tired WASHED UP example of Liston and implanting in our mind what was done to him.

I get your point about this is what you envision Charles doing to the best version but it doesn't cut the mustard for me sorry. Sorta like me saying i picture Liston dropping a peak Charles multiple times and ko'ing him like George Logan (granted i ain't seen it but i am sure you get the point) did.

Like seeing Joe Frazier taking out a peak Holmes like Tyson did. Like seeing Simon Brown dominate a peak SRL like Norris did.

Maybe it's just me :huh

 

Liston never beat anyone as good as Charles, who is underrated as a heavyweight. Charles would have to fight a smart fight and Sonny still dangerous. Charles took a good punch and was the master of the right hand left hook and hook off the jab. I remember an older Liston getting stopped by that combo by Leotis Martin, who was not in Charles class as a boxer or a puncher.

Dangerous fight but so was Louis, I think a focused Charles of the Louis or Marciano 1 fight can outpoint Sonny or hit him enough to bust him up like Ali did

 

Again, by the same token i remember a younger and older Charles getting yo yo'd and ko'd by men that were immensely smaller than Liston and often less talented too. I remember Ali barely throwing a punch vs Holmes and getting beaten by Berbick. I also realise however that such events mean absolutely NOTHING in the grand scheme of things here unless we are matching these versions up?

 

I think Charles when he started to age, lost his reflexes and he was a reflex fighter, I said an older Sonny vs Leotis but the same Sonny that fought Ali would be open to getting hit by Charles. Ezz did not have the legs of Ali, which makes this a hard fight but the Charles of the Marciano or Louis fight may land very well on Sonny. I did not say it was written in stone but I think Ezz could be a problem for Sonny. I think a prime Ezz would be the best fighter Sonny fought next to Ali and a better style than Floyd to beat him. IMO

 

Charles was past it, if he was fighting a prime Sonny Liston he would take a battering like he did from the Rock

 

I don't have a worry with anyone favouring Charles chances or the like, i just cannot fathom Martin being brought into the scheme of things at all.

I would not be surprised to see Liston pull Charles up inside 8 personally. I think Sonny would overpower the best of Marciano.

 

He is alot craftier, in a veteran Murderers Row kinda way, and more accurate IMO

 

Charles is no Clay.

 

Oops, Mac beat me to it with a lot more content too.

 

Yeh it does. But it is skills that would help against Liston.