Prime for prime, best heavyweight ever - head to head

How do people rate Jack Johnson H2H?

 

Lewis did have a better chin than people gave and give hime credit for. My only problem with this record is that people give him too much credit for those revenge matches. First off, he never should have lost to Rachman, who was nothing more than a journey men. Second, the win against MCcall was one of the most anticlimatic in the history of the sport. MCcall was hopped up on coke and for all intents and purposes had a mental breakdown in the ring. And yet, Lewis could not hurt him, could not knock him down and could not even get him to protect himselve. Let us not forget, that fight was officially stopped because McCall would not protect him. Now, Lewis has a fine record in my book, but I cannot comprehend how or why he gets so much credit for his revenge bouts....make absolutely not sense. :rofl

 

It's a viscious circle, isn't it, friend? After all, it's only your opinion that it's idoicy, and since you're opinion doesn't mean anything more than anyone else's...

 

Because he beat every fighter he ever stepped into the ring with, that's why. He gets credit because he came back from 2 stoppage defeats so easily in terms of beating those guys.

 

I didn't say it did. I respect his opinion if he says he thinks Tyson can match Ali's foot-speed and exploit his lack of technical defense. But it's not an 'opinion' about Ali using the 'rope-a-dope'. It's a fact that he didn't use it in his prime. That would be like me saying Joe Frazier was an outside-fighter and master-boxer and saying 'well, it's my opinion'.

 

Rahman I agree...IMO I think he lost focused and got caught...Hell, anybody would have gotten KO'ed if they ate that punch from Rahamn...Perfectly placed and it caught Lewis.

McCall I have to disagree...Is it Lewis fault that McCall flipped the hell out? If I'm not mistaked...McCall had one hell of a chin himself...Who has ever KO"ed McCall??? So for you to sit here and say Lewis should have KO'ed McCall is kinda outlandish dont ya think?

 

Yep. He had the classic old-style stance of the likes of Louis/Burley/Saddler etc in keeping his head off-center and out of the line of his opponent's offense. He could slip and counter the jab better than any HW in history, and was defensively savvy and very strong.

 

That's true. But in my humble opinion, if Tyson had retired after the Douglas fight he would probably be considered a top ten heavyweight. He absolutely decimated his legacy when he was well past his prime against guys like Holyfield and Lewis. Fact is, Tyson was a phenom, and most phenoms excel for a short time and then burn out...like Hendrix or Mozart or Keats, etc. By the time Tyson was 30 he was washed up. That why likely do to the fact that his style was entirely built on speed and power. He was not a particularly good boxer. Not much of an amateur. But he was awkward and fast and had a style that was suited for the pros.

 

H2H or based on accomplishments, it's still Muhammad Ali.

 

It would be outlandish if that was what I actually said. What I said was that he gets too much credit for that win. Of course, it was not his fault that McCall went crazy or whatever the heck happened to him, but that win is often cited as one of his best. Why? atsch It was one of the worst fights I have ever seen. And, by the way, the first stoppage against McCall was not premature. Watch the replay. Lewis was done...end of story.

 

You what?

 

But he didn't do it easily. He lost to one guy that an all time great should not have lost to (Rachman), then he won on a technicality, i.e., a coked up fighter had a mental breakdown in the ring. Of course, that was not Lennox's fault, but have you seen that fight. I could have won that fight. The man across from him refused to throw a punch and would not raise his arms to protect himself. Oh yeah, he was also visibly crying. I think people forget that fight because I often he people talking about how Lewis whipped McCall's ass. Sorry, not true. :huh

 

RIF. Reading is Fundamental.

 

'67 Ali would have had a problem with Tyson's left hook...