Prime Larry Holmes post 2010.

I already adressed all this, go actually read the comments and then come reply to me.

 

He never unified, he never defended against a #1. You are delusional about any context. He just didn't want hard fights

 

31st time it is.
1-) Weaver already got KO'd by Holmes, there was no need for a rematch
2-) Dokes was gonna have a unification bout after he beat Weaver. Don King used the rematch clause for a rematch instead, so Dokes had to fight with Weaver again. They drew, and Dokes lost his next fight to Coetzee and never got relevant again.
3-) Coetzee and Holmes were literally scheduled to fight, match got cancelled because of financial issues.
4-) Thomas is actually fair.

You people have no idea how any of the background things go, especially with a young Don King running around.

 

1. If Weaver is the #1, then Holmes should have fought him.

2. If Dokes was forced to fight Weaver instead, and got a draw, then Holmes could have fought him next. Can you show me evidence that Holmes even suggested it?

3. The fight fell through because Homes withdrew, citing South African politcs.

4. He abandoned a belt rather than fight Page, and took a title form the gutter, contributing to proliferation.

5. Yes, Thomas is fair, as are all the others.

 

1-) Not if he already KO'd him while ahead on all scorecards, though you people would probably cry about him rematching people he already KO'd if he did that as well.
2-) Maybe he would if Dokes didn't get his ass kicked by Coetzee next.
3-) No, the fight was literally called off by Ceasers Palace because of issues with finance and promoters, there's literally a news article about it way back in 1984.
4-) And gained 600.000 dollars more in the process, as Don King once again tried to rip him off as he does everyone else by underpaying him. Maybe things could have been different if Don was a better promoter or if Page had the talent to stay on top consistently and not get randomly chinned by journeymen long enough for a better deal. Plenty of other options than Larry getting underpaid.
5-) Whatever helps you sleep at night.

 

1) If he was #1, then Homes has to fight him

2) You are skipping a step. He was forced to fight Weaver in the rematch. Then fought Coetzee. Which he didn't have to do. Nice job re-writing things.

3) Holmes used the promise of a Coetzee unification to as an excuse not to fight Page, then ran out the clock and abandoned the title. The fight you were speaking of what never a thing until after Holmes had abandoned the WBC belt, and it no longer mattered.

4) He ducked Page and accepted a title from the gutter.

5) You said Thomas is fair play, and you are right.

 

1-) You are not getting a title shot if the champ knocked you tf out while ahead on all scorecards months before your ranking.
2-) Dokes drew with Weaver in a fight that many thought he lost and with many also thinking his first win was a bad stoppage. He needed a win to prove his legitimacy again and he failed, Coetzee beat him up and became the next guy in the line.
3-) What the hell are you even talking about? He didnt fight Page because he was getting underpaid. Even the Frazier fight was more profitable for him. Him and Coetzee regardless of their titles were on their way to fight before the finances and promoters messed it up, thats clearly not a duck either. What do you want the guy to do? Theres nothing he can do with the Coetzee situation and he’s obviously not gonna take a fight where he is getting scammed out of his worth. Do you really think he was afraid of losing to Page or something? Why would he fight an undefeated guy that beat Page then? Im glad you are not a boxer bro you would end up broke.
4-) Yeah, Thomas is, not others.

 

1) But at least he could say he fought ANY #1 contender, which he never did. It was sure easy enough for other champs to do, and even unify. You are not seeing a big pattern, here.

2) He didn't need to prove anything. They could have unified right then and there. Can you show me where Homes tried.

4) If Holmes would have fought Page, he would have beaten his #1 contender and the unification for the two titles would have been simple. Instead, there was nothing on the table until he had already been stripped of the WBC belt, and the financial backing wasn't there anymore.

5) We agree on Thomas. It is simply astonishing that you look at Holmes never fighting a #1 or unifying, like other real champions have all managed, and not understand the common denominator.

 

Nevermind bro you are right. Larry should have just rematched people he KO'd months before. He should have gotten stepped into the ring and get punched while underpaid. He should have assassinated Don King, take his place as the promoter of his opponents and make the fights himself. Its all on him.

 

Do YOU?! He straight up said he wasn't fighting the best opponents out there and was going after soft touches instead. He didn't say "Well I'd fight these guys if it weren't for King lolz"

Yup nothing is ever his fault according to you. He could've been caught on camera committing a murder, subsequently confessed to it, and you still would find a way to make excuses for him.

If it looks like a duck, acts like a duck, sounds like a duck, ADMITS it's a duck........

I'll give Holmes a pass for Coetzee but certainly not Dokes.
They absolutely could've fought following Dokes-Weaver. In fact Dokes' team reached out to Holmes after. Instead of having a unification bout, Holmes instead...... signed a deal with NBC, for back to back fights against Frank, and Marvis. Please make me laugh and say they were the toughest opposition around.

Yeah I forgot, all of a sudden guys like Spoon, Weaver, and Snipes who didn't look like much chops beforehand, inexplicably put on a career best performance against Holmes out of left field. Couldn't possibly be the fact that Holmes wasn't this ATG destroyer he's depicted as on this forum.

This is just a flat up lie. Weaver was unranked, until the fight was announced, and the WBC mysteriously gave him the number 8 spot.

Bey beat Page in '84. Page was the mandatory in '83, so your laughable excuses won't work here.[/QUOTE]

 

He should have fought any #1 contender and unified belts, just like every other major champion.

 

[/QUOTE]
You can disagree if you want but I'm not gonna criticize Holmes for not having a unification bout with a guy that won the belt off of a controversial stoppage, drew with the same guy he took the title from and lost the title within a year.

Right except Holmes put on great performances in the same fights as well, they were excellent fights with plenty of high-level stuff put on by both sides. Weaver had his best performances right after he beat Holmes. So did Spoon. And Snipes got his ass kicked barring that one right hand he landed. In retrospect you can't name many champs that fought opposition equal to the best versions of Smith, Weaver, Spoon, Bey, Cooney, Williams and the like.

That's not even why I said it lmao, I already explained why that match did not happen, I mentioned Bey to show that Page would have gotten wiped off of the planet even if the fight was made.

 

There’s always an excuse with you.

Holmes gets a pass for ducking Dokes—even though Dokes sent him an offer before he lost the title. But somehow, because he lost after Holmes avoided him, that makes it okay?

Holmes also gets a pass for skipping his mandatory in ’83 because his challenger happened to lose in ’84. Makes sense—if Holmes had a time machine.

And what about Pinklon Thomas? Why is that a legitimate duck in your eyes? He lost to Lawrence Carter years later. Shouldn't that invalidate what he earned at the time too?

Fighters deserve shots based on what they were when they earned them, not based on losses years down the line. That logic only applies if you’re retroactively justifying ducking.

For the record: I agree—Holmes likely beats Page and Dokes. But that's irrelevant. He doesn’t get credit for fights he didn’t take, and he doesn’t get a free pass just because you think the outcome was inevitable.

 

I'm changing my vote to fringe because I've had it with all the whiny bitching and mental gymnastics made on Holmes behalf for ducking his best contenders.

Edit: Guess not, thanks @JohnThomas1

 

Do you have a source on that? Don King would never let his 2 title holders face each other.