Prime Mayweather vs Hagler of the SRL fight?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by MoneyMay1, Nov 24, 2021.

  1. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist Full Member

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    This is patently false. Not only was Canelo bigger than Hagler, he was also stylistically similar. Hagler at that stage of his career would have had all sorts of problems with Mayweather, who was better than 160 Leonard.

    I'll also remind you that Mayweather was 36 years old for Canelo.
     
  2. Blaxx

    Blaxx Member Full Member

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    1. SRLs power carried well above 147 (enough to KO Kalule, Lalonde and wobble Hearns). That alone was enough to occasionally discourage Hagler.
    2. SRLs footwork also moved up well post 147 and he could circle and dance around the ring. Floyd was already very immobile at 147 and adapted beautifully to defend in the pocket and counter.
    3. SRL threw combos and stayed active enough to beat Hagler. At 147 Floyd didn't throw in combination like that.

    If Floyd wins, his strategy has to be different to Leonard's. I felt Leonard fought a perfect fight all things considered, yet he barely won and it's disputed to this day. My guess is that Hagler would win, probably wide, even if Floyd survives or makes adjustments later on.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2021
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  3. Loudon

    Loudon Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Great post.

    Even if we humour each other and assume for the sake of the debate that the fight would have taken place, there’s no way on earth that Floyd would have been as offensive minded as what Ray was. That would have been a given. And although Marvin showed too much respect to Duran and Ray, would he realistically have done the same to a safety first fighter in Floyd?
     
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  4. Loudon

    Loudon Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I’m being deadly serious here, I don’t know if you’re trolling me for a joke.

    Canelo was slightly heavier than Marvin.

    He wasn’t taller, and he didn’t have a bigger reach.

    Stylistically similar?

    What?

    A counterpuncher, vs a switch hitting southpaw who could box, fight and pressure?

    They were nothing alike.

    At the higher weights, Floyd was a safety first fighter with hand issues. So how would he have caused Marvin all sorts of issues? He would never have been as offensive and as aggressive as what Ray was against him. He didn’t possess Ray’s power or confidence. And Marvin would never have stood off of him like how he did with Ray.

    Floyd and Ray were two different characters with two different styles.

    Yes, Floyd was 36 and past his best against Canelo. But YOU made the reference.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2021
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  5. Loudon

    Loudon Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Great post.

    I look forward to No Neck’s rebuttal.
     
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  6. scandcb

    scandcb Active Member Full Member

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    Mayweather gives Hagler some issues. But Hagler still does enough to win on points.

    Mayweather just wasn't quite in the same league as Leonard and Duran.
     
  7. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist Full Member

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    Canelo and Hagler both used patient aggression. It's disingenuous to refer to Canelo as a counterpuncher when he's primarily a front foot fighter. Canelo is physically bigger than Hagler and the same was true at 154. He has chopped down various 6 foot plus fighters so I wouldn't call Hagler's reach advantage a big deal.

    The bottom line is that Hagler didn't have the greatest legs or punch output when he fought Leonard. And Mayweather always got respect with his power and dictated the pace.
     
  8. Rollin

    Rollin New Member Full Member

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    I was always a bit anti-Leonard when it comes to his fight with Marvin. Ray was an opportunist, much like Mayweather. He got the gloves and the ring he wanted, and he waited until Hagler was disinterested and nearly retired. Even then he got an incredibly controversial decision that majority of experts call a draw or a victory for Hagler.

    There is no way for Mayweather to make Hagler respect his power. Marvin on the other hand was one of the finest and most educated pressure fighters in the history of the division and a damn fine switch-hitter to boot. Size seals the deal.
     
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  9. Loudon

    Loudon Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    It’s not disingenuous at all.

    Marvin was a southpaw who could switch.

    Marvin could fight in a way than Canelo can’t.

    They don’t have the same styles.

    The version of Canelo who fought Floyd was about 5 pounds heavier than Marvin, and no taller, with a lesser reach.

    Regarding Hagler’s reach, we’re looking hypothetically from Floyd’s perspective, not Canelo’s. Floyd had a reach advantage over Canelo and almost every other fighter he faced apart from Oscar. Marvin had a bigger reach than Floyd.

    Yes, Marvin didn’t produce a huge output against Ray, mostly because he stood off of Ray, and Ray danced around the ring and threw great combinations.

    Floyd would never have danced like that. He didn’t do that. He also wouldn’t have dazzled Marvin with 5-6 punch rapid fire combinations. Again, he didn’t do that.

    Floyd wouldn’t have gained Marvin’s respect in the way that Ray did. Floyd was a safety first fighter with hand issues up at the higher weights. Marvin wouldn’t have stood off of him. Floyd wouldn’t have dictated the pace. None of that is realistic.

    Floyd vs Marvin would have been a completely different fight to the 87 ‘Superfight’

    Different fighters. Different styles. Different tactics.

    Your whole argument seems to stem from the fact that Floyd easily beat Canelo, who was a similar size to Marvin.

    It’s skewed logic.

    Again, a slightly smaller Maidana gave Floyd far more issues than what Canelo did.

    Styles make fights.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2021
  10. scandcb

    scandcb Active Member Full Member

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    You are wasting your time.

    Mayweather is an unbeatable beast and perfect human being according to NoBrain.
     
  11. Fogger

    Fogger Member Full Member

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    If Mayweather could bring his same skill set to 160 fought like Leonard he could potentially beat Hagler. The problem is that it wouldn't happen that way. Mayweather did not have the ridiculously high boxing IQ of SRL. Mayweather would fight how he usually does and Hagler, who almost beat Leonard, would beat Mayweather

    To digress slightly, Boxing IQ is also the reason Leonard would beat Mayweather at 147 or 154.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2021
  12. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist Full Member

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    Lol at Leonard having a higher holding IQ than Mayweather.
     
  13. Fogger

    Fogger Member Full Member

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    I don't agree with everything you wrote but I do appreciate a well thought out, intelligent post. Nice job.
     
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  14. surfinghb

    surfinghb Boxing Addict Full Member

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    You actually can put weight, height, strength, speed, work rate , resume, and power well before you get to the IQ debate part .. just so you know
     
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  15. Fogger

    Fogger Member Full Member

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    That's true, but sometimes IQ allows a boxer to use all the factors you just mentioned to win a fight.