Prime Mike Tyson (88) vs Prime Muhammad Ali (66)

Tyson was improving but lost focus.

 

Not true. Boxing is unique in that regard. One fight even a winning effort can end a fighters prime. Wilfred Benitez was a shot fighter at 25 years of age. Fernando Vargas was certainly diminished after Trinidad when he was only 23 years old.
I'm not saying that was the case with Tyson. His issued were lifestyle and generally mental. He had climbed the mountain and didn't really have any else to fight for. After Spinks. Immaturity, complacency etc.
He wasn't past his physical prime but mentally he wasn't there, not focused for Douglas. He had been dropped in sparring by Greg Page earlier in that week.

Many great fighters can win when they are off their game but that night he was facing a guy who was super talented and determined for once in his career.

 

Ali was just so incredibly quick on his feet, in his prime when he could dance all night, there's no one that could take him, he just had too much of everything. On top of all the speed, reflexes, distance mastery, angle mastery, pacing mastery, iron jaw, indominable spirit and everything else, he also could hit hard in relation to his dancing style. He was no slouch when he sat down on his shots, but to me his most impressive aspect regarding power was when in combination with his flowing, alternating side to side lateral movement.

In this way Ali truly did float like a butterfly, shifting his footwork this way & that in a very unpredictable manner, left & right, in & out. The sting was indeed there, although obviously not in the abundance possessed by Shavers, Foreman, Tyson etc. But it was more than enough to get the opponent's attention.

 

We only learned what a chin he had in his post exile iteration though he did take some hellacious body shots from Liston when he couldn't see.

 

Yeah definitely post exile Ali showed his iron chin (a little too often, perhaps - would have been nice if he retired after maybe the Thrilla).

I've seen people say Ali's chin was overrated pre exile because of the Henry Cooper knockdown, but it was to my eyes one of those dead-flush shots that land perfectly and would've put just about anyone else down. The fact that Ali got right up and continued dominating the next round actually suggests that his chin was indeed legendary, even at that young age. That was one hell of a shot and Cooper could crack!

 

But it can also be true too.

Some might argue Leon Spinks peaked at a similar age in his 8th pro fight and was never the same. They could mount a reasonable case. Life in the fast lane has cut many a prime short in a great many sports. The fast lane has also led to supremely talented sportsman never making it that otherwise would have. Some were burnt out by 24. It happens.

 

The thing with Tyson is that people try to give him free passes that no other fighter gets.

I can agree with the idea that a fighter can be past it at 24, that doesn't mean he's past his physical prime, just his boxing prime. Say you train your arse off up until 23 and then basically do nothing for the last year, it makes sense that you're not going to be as sharp but here's the catch.

Holyfield said Tyson was the only boxer that trained harder than him, why don't any of Tyson's past opponents get a free pass for being in a lesser condition than Mike because I guarantee non of these opponents were in the shape of Tyson when he defeated them? People think it was all about natural talent when it clearly wasn't as he lost quite quickly after parting with Rooney. That tells us that being in amazing shape was a big part of Tyson's success, why does he get a pass when others don't?

 

Probably because when Tyson was on his game 1986-88 he dominated the division in a way few ever have. Not just unifying the titles but he devastated his opposition. He made bigger men fight scared enough that the only way they could last the distance was to hold on and forget about trying to win.

Tyson electrified the sportsworld. A spectacular performer for a significant period of time. For those of us who witnessed it we have it burned into our brain..

 

But how many of his opponents get a pass for not being at their absolute peak when they faced him?

 

Cooper was very light compared to Tyson though, however on average Ali did have an incredible chin.

 

I don't think that was peak Ali tbh, a prime Tyson would have had a real chance of knocking out that version of Ali, still, I don't think an Ali facing Tyson would ever switch off like that and allow himself to get tagged so easily.

Let's be realistic though, prime for prime, Tyson would be a real threat for Ali and would be one of the few that could potentially knock him out.

 

Oh definitely Cooper couldn't hit like Tyson, but that shot he landed on Ali was huge and would've knocked down most anybody.

 

I rarely see Tyson's fans give his opponents even 25% of the benefit of the doubt they give Tyson. Some of them honestly had even worse circumstances than him, not just in terms of boxing but also personally. Some of them crumbled under the pressure, others dealt with it and rose to the occasion. Either you consider everyone's circumstances or you don't give anyone a pass.