Prime Muhammad Ali vs Michael Hunter (Boxing Evolution Theory)

You mean the Michael Moorer that was just 6'2" tall ??

 

Absolutely.

So then take onboard what he’s said.

 

This is a good post.

But we can’t compare any other sports to two guys fighting.

We’re also not doing comparisons from 100 years ago.

All fights are determined by the two fighters match up on the night stylistically.

That means that some of those older guys would have held advantages over today’s guys.

Because in boxing, even the most skilled fighter doesn’t always win. There’s many variables. Many different stylistic match ups.

 

The guy who was just ONE inch smaller than Usyk?

Yeah. That guy.

 

This is perfectly reasonable.

But this is not what Kiwi has said.

Kiwi has said that today’s guys would have DOMINATED the best guys of the 60-80’s.

Which if you’re a knowledgeable fan, is of course ludicrous. And we know that, simply by looking at who today’s guys have lost to and struggled with.

Having said that, I don’t believe for a second that those older HW’s would just easily dominate all of today’s guys.

As a boxing fan for over 30 years, I know that if we had a huge tournament, where it was modern vs old, that the tournament would throw out mixed results.

That is just pure logic. Pure common sense.

Yes, the fighters of the modern era are bigger. But many of them have less ability than those of the past.

The other ludicrous statements being made are:

1. All of the old HW’s would have been CW’s today.

2. A prime Ali couldn’t even have competed.

It’s so ridiculous, I’m going to have to assume that the guy is just trolling for some amusement.

 

How is not ridiculous?

He said that ALL of the old HW’s would have been CW’s.

And on what planet, could a prime Ali not even have been able to have COMPETED today??

You’re telling me that Muhammad Ali couldn’t even have competed with today’s top 10 fighters?

It’s laughable.

Absolutely laughable.

And especially as the current HW king, has Ali’s EXACT dimensions, where he’s beating people on speed and movement instead of power.

 

But Vitali would dominate because of his talent and attributes, not simply because of his size...?

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias

 

Okay.

I’m struggling to see why you wouldn’t have found that comment ridiculous.

Look at today’s top 10.

Their history.

Look at a prime Ali, and his history.

Look logically at how they’d realistically have all matched up on the night stylistically with him.

We can make educated guesses based on lots of evidence.

Saying that Ali couldn’t even compete today, just defies logic.

And again, the ironic thing is, Usyk is currently the king of the HW division, again, where he’s beating people on movement instead of speed, and with the exact same dimensions.

So: Usyk is the current king, yet Ali couldn’t have competed.

That’s Kiwi’s thinking.

Yet it’s completely and utterly illogical.

It’s just a joke.

 

I respect your views. But those examples aren’t in any way relevant to what I’m talking about.

We know that the sport throws out huge shocks.

But what we’re talking about here, is a guy who’s praising the current king, whilst at the same time, saying that a man with many similarities, who many would claim to have been even better, couldn’t even compete today, against a field of fighters, where many of them aren’t even remotely great.

It defies all logic.

All common sense.

So the guy either has zero knowledge of the sport, or he’s trolling.

We can leave it there.

 

This is the problem you have though, in questions such as these, we are considering the survivors, they aren't the general pattern, they are the most elite of the elite. They are the men who have sat atop an entire sport.

Not using survivorship bias here would be the logical flaw.

 

That is my point. Size is nothing without talent.

 

Size is nothing without talent

Totally agree

Let's call it a day then shall we, gentlemen?

 

You can tell us whether or not you’ve been trolling first.

You could also explain to us, how a guy who couldn’t beat Joe Joyce and AJ, could definitely have dominated all the greats of the 60-80’s.

Finally, you could try and explain why the consensus HW GOAT, couldn’t have competed today, against the likes of Zhang, Kabayel, Parker, Usyk and AJ etc.