(PRIME) Oleksandr Usyk vs. (PRIME) Joe Frazier

P4P GOAT and current flavor of the month Usyk struggling with smoking joe in a poll
But I thought Usyk was way better than Mayweather, Robinson, Duran, Leonard, Ali etc?

Is he not by far the best the sport has ever seen? Look at the monsters he beat at Cruiserweight and heavyweight, plus all his success as an amateur!!

 

I feel like Usyk is under credited on the inside in this thread. He got weight bullied by Chisora and mostly found success on the outside in that fight from what I remember, but he's shown he's a great combination puncher at close range gainst several fighters, throwing 6-8 punches on the inside and being out again against many fighters

 

If Usyk fights the perfect fight, he might be able to avoid getting stopped by Frazier. But, he wouldn't win.

 

Usyk outboxes him and possibly stops him late.

 

You cannot compare the advancements fighters have made now and also the amateur experience most of them have, compared to the 50s era fighters. But for fun I would say if Joe would be given the same time and amateur career as Usyk, he would have stopped him. Probably outweighed him also, with all the science behind it now (strength and conditioning being on another level, supplements and other recovery enhancing tactics)

 

Hmm? does your birth year begin with a 2?

 

Usyk would get him on workrate

 

Hmmm…

Do you say “Gee Golly” and “Swell” a lot and yell at little kids if they go on your lawn to retrieve balls they’ve accidentally knocked there?

 

This is a close one, in my view, not at all easy to pick, and I think it goes the distance. I voted for Oleksandr Usyk to win this, because I think, prime vs. prime Usyk wins most times. But, in a best of 7, I think Joe Frazier just might win a few of those fights.

 

My crystal ball has Usyk winning most times.

 

Alot of the extra weight Chisora is carrying is fat though.

And a 210 pound Haye sent Chisora to the shadow realm in just 5 rounds yet Chisora extended multiple Heavyweights who outweighed Haye by 40/50 pounds so what does that tell you ?

A smaller Heavyweight can definitely still have significant power to score stoppages over big Heavyweights and styles make fights.

And the weight difference between Frazier/Usyk is the same as Frazier/Bugner who Frazier beat very wide on the scorecards plus Bugner is taller than Usyk with an 82 inch reach which is 4 inches more than Usyk's at 78.

Now I'm not saying Bugner is remotely like Usyk style wise but I don't think Usyk's size would really bother Frazier that much.

Usyk is a boxer with solid power but not concussive power and he doesn't hit any harder than Ali and he certainly doesn't hit anywhere near as hard as Foreman.

As I've said before I think swarmer is a bad style match up for a boxer type and styles make fights and Frazier excelled vs boxers.

So there's no reason to think Frazier wouldn't have good success vs Usyk.

 

The recency bias on this thread is remarkable.

I am one of the biggest Usyk fans on this forum. But the posts in this thread are comical.

You actually have people suggesting that because Usyk is 5 lbs heavier than Foreman, that this somehow means he can punch like Foreman. This is beyond comical. If Usyk can punch as hard as Foreman, it means he can punch as hard as Lennox Lewis or Mike Tyson.

Ali has proven power. Ali stopped durable fighters like Bonavena and Foreman among others. Ali certainly hit at least as hard as Usyk and likely a bit harder since he has a more proven track record of stopping durable fighters. Yet Frazier absorbed damn near everything from Ali without being stopped. And somehow people think Usyk will stop Frazier?

This thread reminds me of the Joe Joyce vs Tyson threads that were popular on this forum a while ago. Or Martin Bakole supposedly being able to beat ATG's.

Usyk is an all time great. But the idea that somehow handling Chisora is a bigger deal than handling Frazier is comical. Chisora isn't as fast as Frazier. Chisora, despite his size, isn't known to have one of the all time great left hooks like Frazier did. And Chisora certainly can't maintain the work rate that Frazier could due to being a lot heavier. The only thing Chisora has over Frazier is physical strength.

Here is the thing with Frazier: unless you hit like Foreman, you can't keep him off you. I don't care how skilled you are. Usyk even at his best doesn't move faster than the 29 year old Ali who couldn't keep Frazier off him. Is Usyk's power is on the same level as Ali, how is he going to keep Frazier off? The idea that he will just be able to move around the ring and stay out of danger merely through foot movement is comical. Frazier is arguably the best ring cutter in history. No one is dancing away from him for 12 rounds. The quickest heavyweight that ever lived couldn't do it.

If you want to pick Usyk via a close decision, i can understand it. But these laughable posts about how Usyk will destroy him, make it look easy etc. are beyond ridiculous. Usyk has never faced a body puncher who can work his body like this. Taller men like Joshua and Fury simply can't work his body like Frazier could.

The people who think that Usyk is some Foreman like puncher are just as ridiculous as the folks who think Jim Corbett could beat Lennox Lewis.

 

I agree some of the posts in this thread are awful.

Usyk somehow is comparable to Foreman power wise because they're both 6'3 220 pounds absolutely embarrassing logic.

So what if Chisora is bigger than Frazier ? What does that prove ? Absolutely nothing.

Chisora is a fringe contender Frazier is an ATG Heavyweight with the best single win in Heavyweight history.

Comparing Chisora to Frazier is an insult to Frazier and an insult to any boxing fan with any knowledge on the sport.