Prime Oscar De la hoya vs 2007 Floyd Mayweather 147

FLoyd's resume above 135 is suspect!

 

Manny didn't refuse the testing at all. The argument was regarding the cut off date. Manny said that giving blood weakened him, and the tattoos he had were done in his spare time. He said that he didn't want to give blood during the last two weeks of camp, because that was the most crucial part.

He said that he didn't mind being randomly tested at any point during the first 6 weeks of camp, but he didn't want to be tested for the last 2 weeks. He also said that he'd be happy to be tested straight after the fight in the dressing room. Where's the problem? He couldn't possibly hide anything!

Floyd doesn't want the fight! None of Manny's opponents demand what Floyd has. They just get in and fight him.

It's Floyd Snr that started the rumours. If Manny wins big, all the Mayweathers mention roids, but if he doesn't look great they don't say ****! Have you not noticed that? The family are ****ing jokers!

Floyd will put up every obstacle he can, because he's terrified of losing his zero!

Regards, Loudon.

 

No, thats bull****, during the first negotiations, Floyd offered him a cut off date of 14 days before the fight. Manny turned it down. Manny wanted 30 day cut off not 2 weeks so get your facts right. Having a 30 day cuff off is not random tests because you know that you wont get tested for the last month and would have enough time to get the steroids out of system before the test after the fight. Stop with the nonsense excuses. Floyd would be doing the exact tests. The random blood tests do not take enough blood for your body to be weakened. It was just a pathetic excuse.

The reason why other fighter's don't ask Manny for it is because they not in the position of power Floyd Mayweather is. You claim Floyd never wanted the fight but Floyd agreed to all the terms of the contract and sent it to Pacquaio to sign, only for Pacquaio to decline because he didnt want to do the testing. Floyd had signed and agreed everything was ready to fight. To say Floyd was putting up an obstale is nonsense. Both Floyd and Manny had one clause to put in the contract. Manny wanted a 10 million dollar weight penalty and Floyd wanted random testing. If your a true boxing fan, who wants a clean sport then you should be praising Floyd for wanting the proper and strict random testing. The testing commissions like Nevada do is a complete joke.

Actually Floyd sr wasn't the one who started the rumors, it was actually Richard Schaefer of Golden Boy, that's why Pacquaio was trying to sue Golden Boy. If Floyd was terrified of losing his ' 0' then why has he still been fighting the past few years ???

 

But you are forgetting the one major factor in everything you said and I remember clearly Pac and Management agreeing to Random Testing only for Mayweather to come back with ok but your only getting 30% with 40 million offer of a fight that has potential to make 150 million.

Then there was the Terminator call and he is worried for his health.

Remember its not all Pac's fault its both fighters and im a huge Pac fan.

But there both at fault.

 

Its still not a bad resume but remembering and this is what Floyd fans forget.

after 135

140
Demaurcus Corley ranked 7th by Ring (pretty decent Opponent)
Henry Bruseles Not Ranked
Arturo Gatti Ranked 1 by Ring behind Tszyu ((But Gatti was well past it)

2004 and 2005 while Mayweather was there here are the rankings

2004
Kostya Tszyu Champion (Past his best although he killed Mitchell)
Arturo Gatti #1 (was past his better days after the Ward wars)
Vivian Harris #2 (In his Prime but not the best WBA champ)
Sharmba Mitchell #4 (Past his Prime but come off a huge loss to Tszyu)
Miguel Cotto #5 (Early part of Cotto's Prime but a great punch for 140)
Ricky Hatton #6 (Prime Ricky Hatton i feel very good back then)
DeMaarcus Corley #7 (Probably the best version of Corley)
Lovemore NDou #8 (Pretty under rated guy and tough)

Remembering Mayweather moved up and avoided these 2 Prime guys
2005
Ricky Hatton Champion (Prime as Prime after Tszyu win)
Miguel Cotto #2 (Prime version
Kostya Tszyu #3 (But he ended up retiring and was past it)
Jose Luis Castillo #4 (Past his best but a guy that had troubled PBF)
Junior Witter #5 (Prime version of Witter and his style tough)

Now thats just 140 what Floyd left to fight against a Past his best Zab Judah at the worst 147 division I had seen in recent memory instead of staying at 140 were Prime guys were coming through.

I mean at that time Welterweights best guys were

Past his Prime off a few Losses Zab Judah
Cory Spinks which lets face it was not great not like Cotto and Hatton
And that cinderella man Baldomir probably the worst champ at 147 I can remember.

I can do 147 if you want but we all know the best fighters at 147 when Floyd was there were

Paul Williams
Antonio Margarito

Which he never fought just like at 140 he never faced
Tszyu
Cotto
Hatton.

 

Fair enough, but your post implied that Manny refused the testing. So Manny wanted 30 days and not 14? What difference does it make really? It's a 60 day camp. If he gets randomly tested at any point during the first 30, and then straight after the fight, he can't possibly hide anything can he?

If Manny had've agreed, it would be something else. Why should I praise Floyd for trying to clean up the sport? It goes way beyond that and you know it. To my knowledge it was Floyd Snr who first mentioned it after Manny's fight with Oscar, before RS commented.

What do you mean the other fighters haven't got Floyd's power? They're professional fighters in a sport that's life threatening. Their life and careers are on the line in every fight. They're not going to let something like that go. If Ricky, Cotto, Bradley etc,etc, thought that there was anything in what Floyd was saying, they'd demand the exact same thing. The fact that nobody but Floyd demands such tests, speakes volumes.

He's still been fighting these past few years for the attention and the money. There's only Manny out there that he thinks can take his zero.

Floyd doesn't want the fight with Manny it's as simple as that. Like I said yesterday, If Manny wins big, all the Mayweathers shout Roids. If he doesn't, everyone goes quiet.

Why didn't Ricky Hatton want Manny to be tested randomly every day in camp? Why didn't Cotto, Clotey, Marquez, or Bradley, who's just come up from 140? Ask yourself that question.

There is only Floyd that wants him to be tsested in that way. If Manny fights another ten opponents, I guarantee you that none of them will behave like Floyd, and demand that he's tested in such a way.

So what does that tell you?

Floyd is just embarrassing himself! It's got nothing to do with cleaning up the sport, it's the fact that he'll put up every roadblock he can, because there's something in Manny that scares him. When he's got his Dad and his two Uncles in his ear saying things like "That dude got be on something man, to come up two weight classes, and do that, somethings up, it's not possible what he's done" etc, that ****ing shatters Floyd's confidence.

That's why I hate all these fantasy match up threads. If Tommy Hearns was at 147 now at his peak, Floyd wouldn't fight him for a billion dollars!

If it's not the cut off date, it's the purse, if it's not the purse split, it'd be something else, he doesn't want the fight!

Regards, Loudon.

 

Tszyu - Floyd never avoided Tszyu. The reason Floyd and Tszyu couldn't fight was because Tszyu had a contract with showtime and Floyd had a contract with HBO. it was impossible to make

Cotto @140 - When Floyd and Cotto was at 140, they were both with Top Rank. Arum didn't want to make fight because he didn't think Cotto was ready and wanted to build him up more. Arum said in 2005 before Floyd fought Gatti, that a fight between Cotto and Floyd would not happen for atleast a year and a half.

Hatton @140 - Floyd never avoided Hatton. Hatton said he wasn't ready to fight Floyd and wanted a couple of tune ups in the USA before taking on a big name like Floyd

Witter - Floyd had already left 140, before Witter was beltholder. After Floyd beat Gatti he moved up to 147. At that time Witter was fighting at European level and winning only European titles. Witter only became a world champ in september 2009. Mayweather had already beat Judah and Mitchell at welterweight by this point

Paul Williams - Floyd and Williams would never have happened because they have always been managed by the same manager Al Haymon.

Bruseles and Corley were mandatory world titles eliminators he had to take in order to get a shot to get a shot at WBC champ Arturo Gatti

 

Saying you will agree to the media and actually doing are two totally different things. However I do agree both guys are at fault. That's my whole point you can't just blame Floyd, you have to blame Pacquiao aswell. Remember when Arum was making excuses Manny couldn't fight in May because of a cut and also said their needed to be a larger stadium.

 

other way around actually.

 

Had a draw with Miguel Angel Gonzalez (someone he would beat seven shades of **** out of in his prime) in between his 2 fights with Oscar...would lose to the great Willy Wise the following year after the Oscar rematch...Come on, man how the **** was he NOT washed up?

Oscar was great in his fights with Chavez, no doubt about that, but at 36 years old with 100+ fights against a PEAK ATG ODLH??

Anyway, i do favor prime Oscar over Floyd tho.

 

Having a 30 day cut off is not random testing. With a 30 day cutoff, you know you wont be tested for 30 days until after the fight which is enough time for you take steroids and then have it out of system before you get tested after the fight. It was Richard Schaefer who the first one to accuse Pacquiao not Floyd Sr. Bob Arum even said it was Schaefer who first accused Pacquiao, hence why they tried to sue Golden Boy.

If you actually have a brain then you would realize what I mean about other fighter's not having Floyd Power. Think about it. None other the other fighters are superstars and can't call the **** like Floyd can. Guys like Bradley, Hatton need Pacquiao for the big payday, they can't make big money fight anybody else other than Floyd. That's why he can't call the shots like Floyd can. To be honest random testing never occured to like to Hatton and Cotto.

You keep saying Floyd won't fight Manny but Floyd signed a contract to face Manny. It was in Mannys hand to sign and we would have had the fight in March 2010, so how can you say Floyd won't fight Manny when Floyd has signed a contract to face him before ??? You also claim Floyd scared of losing his "0" but if he is scared of losing his zero why he has he still been fighting ??? Any time you step in the ring there is a risk you can lose, anybody can be beat on any given night, all it takes is one punch, that's the beauty of boxing.

You keep saying Floyd keeps putting roadblocks, but all he asked for is random testing. Both fighters had a a clause they wanted in the contract, Floyd wanted random testing, while Manny wanted a larger weight penalty. Floyd agreed to what Manny wanted. Floyd wasn't the one making excuses such as " i'm afraid of needles" "blood weakens me". Arum was also making excuses earlier in the year saying " Manny can't fight in May because of the cut", " we need to build a larger stadium" and lots of other excuses Pacquiao camp made. You can't just blame Floyd for it not happening, Pacquaio deserves alot of the blame too. Lets remember Freddie Roach has had 3 fighters caught for steroids before. The Mayweather and Schaefer were not the only guys suspicious of Pacquiao, there is a whole list of guys who were suspicious of Pacquiao

Name me one other boxer out their who would have turned down random testing like Pacquiao did ? guys like Martinez, Bradley, Canelo are all happy to do any testing. Mosley, Cotto, Ortiz all agreed to testing, without hesitation.

You say Floyd wouldn't fight Hearns, why wouldn't he ? There's big money and Hearns has nothing to hide.

 

Come on Now! Do you seriously think that Manny's intentions, were to take steroids as soon as the 30th day was up? You think on the 31st day, he'd start loading up whenever he wanted, knowing that they'd have left his system after the fight?

I have a brain, and I know exactly what you mean when you say Floyd has power. But after the accusations and the scandels, no other boxer has wanted Manny to be tested in the same way. Now that is because, they either don't agree with the accusations, or they're simply that desperate for the payday, they don't want to kick up a fuss, and they'll let it slide. Now I don't believe the latter for a second. I respect your opinion, you clearly know a lot about boxing, but I don't believe the latter for a second.

If all Manny's opponents after the accusations came out, believed it, they'd all be saying, we also want him tested like Floyd, because our livelihood is at stake. You're not telling me that if someone like Cotto agreed with the accusations, that he'd just fight him anyway? No chance!

Bradley's just moved back to 147, from 140, he's not going to fight if he thinks he's at an unfair advantage. How many fights has Manny Had since Oscar? Because that's when I first heard about it. Do you think Marquez going into third fight wasn't going to say anything and keep quiet, if he thought there was something in it?

Anyway, the last I heard the cut off date had been agreed, but there was a problem with the purse split?

The thing is with the rumours that started, they were based on nothing. Manny gained weight to move up through the divisions, and obviously he had to bulk up. That does not mean he was taking anything. It's just speculation based on him moving up and beating someone at a higher weight. It's just someone's opinion.

You've given me a long list of fighters, and asked the question why were they happy to do the testing?

What your not taking into consideration is, most of them have never been accused, so why would they refuse?

Manny hasn't been asked, he's been accused of being a cheater. There's a world of difference. You can look at Manny's refusal from two perspectives.

1. If he's innocent, then why doesn't he take the test? (That's obviously what you think)

2. Why the **** should Manny give into Floyd's demands, when he's been accused of doing something that he hasn't done?

If I was Manny and someone said to me, take the test and clear your name, i would honestly turn around, and say No! Why the **** should I? I haven't done anything wrong!

Why should he bow down to Floyd? Nobody before Floyd has demanded that he should take a test, and nobody has since, so why should he?

But like I say, and you'll have to correct me I'f I'm wrong, but I thought in the end he'd agreed to it, but they were arguing about something else?

I think if Manny hadn't have been accused, and they'd have been a new law in Boxing stating what Floyd wants, then I don't think he'd have had a problem with it. But Manny's been backed into a corner. He's been accused of cheating with absolutely no evidence to base it on, and he's had his name dragged through the mud. I think a lot of those fighters that you've listed, would also have told Floyd to get ****ed, if they'd have been accused too.

What about all of Floyd's opponents before the accusations came out? He didn't want any of them to be tested in the same way did he? He wasn't trying to clean up the sport then. He wasn't bothered. He just got in the ring and fought. Now he has no choice but to kick up a fuss with whoever he fights. He obviously can't not ask for them to be tested after the fuss he's created over Manny.

He doesn't want the fight! He didn't have to agree with RS did he? A lot of fighters out there think Manny's innocent.

Like I say, when Manny wins big, he's on roids, but if has a bad night, nobody brings it up. How convenient.

Every time Manny has fought in the last few years, Floyd has been interviewed afterwards. Each time he's accused Manny of taking something, and he's said "tell him to take the test!"

Now after the Marquez fight when they interviewed Floyd, he never said anything about a test. He said "tell him to sign the fight, I know I can beat him" Ha! Hilarious! Do you know why he said that? Because he knew that he'd beaten Marquez easy, and it gave him a confidence boost.

If Manny had've knocked out Marquez easy, he'd have said "tell him to take the test!" But because Manny struggled with him, he never mentioned anything. Read between the lines. It's not a coincidence.

Of course there's a risk involved in each fight, but Floyd only takes fights, that he's certain he can win.

Floyd will never fight Manny, Saul Alvarez or Sergio Martinez. Those fights would be very dangerous for Floyd, and I bet he doesn't fight any of them.

You're kidding yourself if you think Floyd would have gotten in the ring with Hearns. He wants to retire with his zero, if Tommy was around now, Floyd would have retired. He struggled with a 34 year old Oscar, who'd only fought twice in 3 years, what would he have done with Tommy? Tommy was a freak of nature at 147.

Tommy would be like a dinosaur to Floyd. Floyd Snr, and Roger would never let it happen. Floyd would run for the hills!

It's been nice debating with you!

Regards, Loudon.

 

ajackman,

Who do you think Floyd will fight next?

Regards, Loudon.

 

He couldn't put a dent on Baldomir either.

Say lol again...:tired

 

Well if you only want to be tested 30 days before the fight, its obviously very suspiscous, thats why 30 days is not random testing, It would be **** easy to take something and have it leave your system before the the test after the fight. Let me ask you a simple question, if your a clean athlete why would only want to be tested up until 30 days of the fight ?? it makes no sense.

Secondly the reason the guys Pacquiao hasn't been facing haven't asked him to do the testing is because they ain't got the position of authority and becuase they need Pacquaio for the Payday. Think about. If Floyd and Manny can't make a deal, Floyd can easily fight somebody else and make 30 + million, he doesn't need Manny financially, however the other guys do. All fighters want to be set financially and make big paydays. Think about it, a guy like Tim Bradley got 7 million against Pacquiao, do you really believe hes going to risk asking Pacquiao do testing, and Pacquiao turning him down and as result him losing that 7 million payday ? Bradley needs the exposure and Money that Pacquiao fight would give him. Hardly anybody knew who Bradley was, now Bradley was making the news and getting paid. You look at a guy like Mosley, who had a divorce and lost alot of money because of it, do you believe he going to risk losing the 5 million payday against Pacquaio, when was very lucky even getting the fight because he was coming off two losses ?

The rumors about Pacquiao being in steroids are rumors, Im not disagreeing. However Pacquiao could have proved this rumors wrong by agreeing to the testing. I have also been told that VADA offered to do random testing for the Bradley fight but VADA got turned down. People say how can you accuse you Manny when he hasn't failed a test ? but that don't mean anything, the testing boxing comissisons do are a joke, its **** easy to pass. Boxing commissions such as Nevada don't even use Blood tests to test for PEDS. What a complete joke. Guys like Lamont Peterson and Andre Berto passed commission tests but when they took random testing they caught. The thing why people are susipicous of Pacquiao is becuase its very suspious how Pacquiao has gained so much lean muscle mass while regaining and even seemingly improving his power and Speed. When fighter contuinally move up in the weight, they lose some of power and speed, that ain't the case with Pacquiao. Im not accusing him of anything but hes either got be a freak of nature or on PEDS.

Your saying why should he bow down to Floyd demands ?? what are you on about. It random drug tests, they are both taking the same tests. All it is a blood test, why would you complain about taking it ?? if your clean, a blood test would be the least of your worries. The thing is your not realizing that both Floyd and Manny had a clause in the contract. Floyd wanted drug testing and Manny wanted a larger weight penalty. So how can you say why should Manny bow down to Floyd'd demands, when he is demanding something from Floyd ??. Secondly no, I don't think ended up agreeing. Manny aint signed to the contract to do the testing. Him and his camp have all been saying different things. Roach and Ariza said they never agreed and would only do the testing the commission said to do. Arum said they didnt want USADA to do testing. Manny said something else.

And No Manny hasn't been backing into a corner and had his name dragged into the mud, all he has to do shut his accusers up is do the testing. Thats all he has to do. There is no reason why he can't do random testing in his own fights.

You claim Floyd don't want the fight but he signed the contract. It was all Pacquiao hands. The thing is you claim Floyd only fights guy he's certain he can beat. But your forgetting Floyd has the ability to beat anybody out there, nobody ever questioned his skills. To say Floyd only fights hes certain to beat is nonsense, every fight is risk, anybody can beat on any given night. guys like Pacquiao and Martinez are all beatable fighter's, they have alot of flaws. In order to get to Floyd's level you have to have been through tough opponents, be strong mentally and have supreme confidence in your ability. Floyd resume is solid. To say Floyd would never fight Alvarez, Martinez or Pacquiao is nonsense. They are all beatable. Finally about Floyd/Hearns. Look I don't see why Floyd wouldn't fight Hearns, there is a lot of Money their, why wouldn't he ??